deathtocapslock | GOF Chapter 12: The Triwizard Tournament

Peeves splashes the kids with waterballoons. Of course Ron fares worse than Harry and Hermione. And Minerva is helpless to stop Peeves. Is the drying spell Albus uses on Harry in HBP so advanced these incoming 4th years don't know it yet?

Harry hopes the Sorting would end soon. The oldest among this year's new students were born 10 months after the end of VoldWar 1. If British wizards had a post-war Baby Boom, this cohort is its first, so I hope Harry finds the patience.

Can someone please tell me why Dennis Creevey is in the story? Is it just to frustrate any attempt to understand the inheritance of magic in Rowling's world? But since he is here we are reminded of Parvati's twin sister, who will be needed as a date to the ball - and then forgotten.

Yes Harry, Severus' hatred (or resentment, or something) intensified the night of Sirius' escape, but not necessarily for the reason you think. Don't forget that Severus shut up immediately when he realized Sirius' escape was orchestrated by The Twinkly Headmaster. And Severus recovered the wand that Sirius used that night. Which means that once he got to his rooms, and recovered from the events of the night (which included sustaining a concussion), Severus must have arranged to PI his wand (just to know to what use Sirius had put it) and discovered that Sirius was the one who banged his already injured head against the walls of the tunnel, but also that Peter was alive and a rat Animagus (via the spell that forced him into human form). Which means Peter was the traitor - and also that this traitor escaped. IOW Severus is angry with the trio for attacking and injuring him that night, and thus setting up the events that led to Peter's escape. Of course he is also angry with Sirius for still believing Severus deserved to be eaten by a werewolf at 16 and for aggravating his injuries in the shack. (BTW we have no evidence to suggest Severus needed a new wand after being disarmed by the trio and being injured with his own wand by Sirius. In case you were wondering.)

The first years are soaking wet. The drying spell, Minerva! No such luck. Maybe it really is advanced magic.

The Sorting Hat claims to have never been wrong. Yet it sometimes Sorts people 'too soon'.

MALcolm BADdock, the boy with the most ominous name ever, joins Slytherin House, to the brave and bold hissing of the twins. Harry wonders if the boy knows he is joining the House that produced more Dark witches and wizards than the others. And what do you think do Slytherins think when Dennis Creevey is Sorted to Gryffindor? The House of bullies, jerks and vain peacocks?

Nearly-Headless-Nick performs his third-most significant plot function by bringing the Hogwarts house-elves to Hermione's attention.

Dumbledore makes sure students break the rules all year by telling them it was Filch who forbade the various assault-toys. (Thanks, Terri, for this observation!)

Oh no! No Quidditch this year! Good thing we had the World Cup to remind us of the who-has-the-better-broom contest!

Aha! This year's villain makes a dramatic entrance! Why doesn't anyone pay attention to the sound effects?

Albus and Hagrid are the only ones to applaud 'Moody'. Does this make him an 'interesting creature'? Looks like even those familiar with Moody's record don't appreciate him becoming DADA teacher. Or perhaps it's because of that familiarity?

'Moody' drinks from his hip-flask, but eats the food served in his plate. Has the wizarding world not invented the ability to deliver poisons in food?

So, the Triwizard Tournament was started around 1300, give or take a few years, held every 5 years for a while, then disbanded for centuries but for an occasional failed attempt to restore it. So whose idea was to hold it at Hogwarts now? Especially when the very same departments were involved in hosting the QWC? I used to think it was Dumbles' reaction to Peter's escape and Sybil's second prophecy, but obviously if Bertha knew so much about it before leaving for Albania the planning must have started much earlier. Was this Ludo Bagman's idea of creating more venues for gambling? Or Fudge's idea of distracting the populace from the failed hunt for Sirius Black?

I know: The mastermind of it all was Ludo Bagman! After all Bertha Jorkins had been working in his department. He initiated the renewal of the Triwizard tournament specifically in order to bring Voldemort back. He then gave Bertha the idea to visit Albania so that Voldemort would capture her and use her information. And yes, he got Arthur the tickets in order to give Barty Jr a chance to observe Harry from close-up. The whole business with the goblins was just a cover.

Anyway, everyone agrees that's the best way to establish ties between students of traditionally rival schools who know nothing about each other. Just look how well the House Cup competition does this kind of thing at Hogwarts!

Dumbledore will ensure personally that no underage student will get hirself selected. We'll see how hard he's going to work on that. Anyway, it seems Albus believes that once a wizard is of age it is completely up to hir choice to go and risk hir life for fame and riches (or just walk to death to weaken an enemy).

Fred wants to enter the tournament because he might be able to do forbidden magic and get 1000 Galleons.
Ron wants to have a chance at the money too.
Neville wants to enter to appease his grandmother. He also reminds us of the existence of the trick stair.

Dean adds a Quidditch poster to his football one. Maybe some Muggle-raised wizards do not completely disown the world of their birth? (Though 3 years from now he will be camping with runaway wizards and goblins, not staying with Muggle family and friends.)

Once more Harry dreams of being a star despite already being one for 3 years running.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

From:

sunnyskywalker

Maybe the Creevey brothers support the theory (Red Hen's, I think?) that there's a bunch of different magical "genes" (or whatever), and if you inherit enough different ones, that tips you over into being magical - so Mr. and Mrs. Creevey evidently had just the right combo. Although I don't remember whether we heard anything about Mrs. Creevey, so is it possible she was a witch and left the Muggle world after Dennis was born or something?

The Tournament really doesn't seem like a good way to get the kids to like each other, does it? Now, if the Champions had to work together on the tasks, that would be another story.

It seems odd that they haven't invented magical security cameras to keep an eye on the Great Hall just in case the age line fails. It's almost like they wanted underage kids to cheat to get in...

I like your Ludo Bagman speculations! Maybe unbeknownst to everyone he's the "most devoted servant" :D

From:

madderbrad.livejournal.com

The wonderful story "The Lie I've Lived" by jbern on fanfiction.net has Harry castigating Dumbledore for his leaving the goblet open to sabotage. Later on someone else tries to interfere with its workings (it's used again in the story) ... and we find that Dumbledore actually learned from his prior mistake ... and he'd put up a magical portrait to keep watch over the goblet at all times. The portrait saw everything and tells Dumbledore the identity of the saboteur (although it didn't actually raise an alarm at the time of the intrusion, hmmm).

So that's your "magical security camera" - Rowling's magically sentient paintings.

From:

sunnyskywalker

Now there's an idea!

I wonder - are we supposed to believe that with portraits all over Hogwarts, there aren't any in the Great Hall? Or were they asleep (or Confunded)?

From:

urbanman1984.livejournal.com

Crouch had an invisibility cloak. Moody had two. None of these cloaks was a Deathly Hallow, but I expect they both made the impostor invisible.

From:

sunnyskywalker

Now that could have been interesting, because Dumbledore knows Harry has a cloak - if he had had portraits keeping an eye on things, that's something that would make him think maybe Harry really did put his name in somehow. Of course it would also mean he'd have to consider "Moody," and it's way too early in the book for that. (He'd also have had to have to put an anti-Disillusionment charm on the line, something like that waterfall at Gringott's maybe.)

From:

majorjune.livejournal.com

Anyway, everyone agrees that's the best way to establish ties between students of traditionally rival schools who know nothing about each other.

Like they can't hold the wizarding equivalent of a science fair? Or hold intramural dances?

Or why not have the best Quidditch teams from the schools then meet for matches against each other, to determine which school has the best team? Granted, there'd be rivalry between the schools, but also a chance for interaction with foreign students, and you'd also have a reason for all houses in Hogwarts to join together to root for the home team...

From:

oryx_leucoryx

Or hold intramural dances?

The only time in 6 years Hogwarts has a dance is for the Yule ball which is part of the Triwizard Tournament tradition. I wonder how wizards even know how to dance, they have so few opportunities for it.

From:

madderbrad.livejournal.com

I wonder how wizards even know how to dance, they have so few opportunities for it.

Maybe that's why McGonagall conducts dancing lessons in the movie version of this book?

From:

darth-eldritch.livejournal.com

you'd also have a reason for all houses in Hogwarts to join together to root for the home team...

Oh, no, that would entail acceptance of evul Slytherin by the other houses.

From:

oryx_leucoryx

Well, they'll make Harry captain of the Hogwarts team, and he will end up with a DA version of it - no Slytherins allowed. Then everyone will diss the Slytherins for not cheering for the team. And all will be well.

From:

darth-eldritch.livejournal.com

Of course that would be arranged by some conveniant series of incidents showing that our poor misunderstood hero Harry deserves the captaincy, and fault will typically be found with Slytherins the way it happened when the House Cup was taken from the Slytherins at the last moment. Complete with a lecture from Dumbledore on why Harry must be treated special because he's been through soooo much.

From:

dracasadiablo.livejournal.com

Is the drying spell Albus uses on Harry in HBP so advanced these incoming 4th years don't know it yet?....
The first years are soaking wet. The drying spell, Minerva! No such luck. Maybe it really is advanced magic.

Nope, not advanced magic. Just not something the teachers will use on some unimportant, random characters. Who cares if they are wet (and since it is September probably cold)!
The extra effort is only reserved for Harry.

I know: The mastermind of it all was Ludo Bagman! After all Bertha Jorkins had been working in his department. He initiated the renewal of the Triwizard tournament specifically in order to bring Voldemort back. He then gave Bertha the idea to visit Albania so that Voldemort would capture her and use her information. And yes, he got Arthur the tickets in order to give Barty Jr a chance to observe Harry from close-up. The whole business with the goblins was just a cover.
That would have been interesting and surprising. But we can't have somebody Arthur likes be truly evil. /bitter

From:

fishinginthemud.livejournal.com

Has there ever been a character Harry or the other "good" guys liked who turned out to be an unequivocal baddie? I don't count Stan Shunpike because there's still a suggestion he's being mind-controlled. The only example that comes to mind is Mundungus Fletcher, who Harry seems neutral on at first (but who the twins definitely like) and eventually grows to loathe. Even as a nominal adult, Harry's pretty easy to manipulate; all you have to do is be mildly polite to him and he'll decide you're "on his side" and be willing to defend your reputation no matter how little he knows you. Even Fletcher only became a bad guy when he started stealing *Harry's* stuff.

From:

sharaz-jek.livejournal.com

Harry liked Fake!Moody, and he... well he didn't dislike Fudge pre-the end of this book (though that was more due to favoritism than liking him as a person).

From:

oryx_leucoryx

But Fudge was the one who unjustly arrested Hagrid in COS! What's this lack of loyalty?

From:

sharaz-jek.livejournal.com

Fudge was nervously twirling his boulder. That makes him a Comedy Coward and Innocent Dupe. It's okay to like those people, as long as you don't trust them with anything important.

From:

fishinginthemud.livejournal.com

True enough. It would have been interesting to see how he felt about Crouch Jr. if he had known the man as himself. I'm also thinking of Quirrell, who Harry actually feels sorry for, but he might not count either since Voldemort basically kidnapped him and took over his mind. It just doesn't seem like Harry's ever picked up on the idea that there are perfectly pleasant, charming, likable people who can turn out to be deeply problematic underneath, and not because they're being possessed by Evil Itself. Even people who like him and are nice to him.

Rowling hints at this kind of understanding when she has other characters describe young Tom Riddle, but when she actually shows him as a child, it's like she can't bear to have readers think for a moment that he might not be the most evil ill-begotten bastard who ever lived. We were supposed to be impressed with Dumbledore for seeing through Riddle when we first heard about him in CoS, but then Rowling felt the need to beat us over the head with his undisguised nastiness, presumably so that slower readers could feel as smart and superior as Dumbledore. Or maybe she was just afraid Riddle would acquire fangirls, which she seems to have taken it upon herself to reeducate. I wouldn't be surprised if she thinks it her public duty.

In a mature, realistic story, Harry would feel uneasy about Hagrid and the Weasley's polite bigotry and truly wonder if his prejudice against Slytherins didn't make him a bigot himself. He would have learned that Evil is not a snake-faced monster, but something that exists in him and people he loves, who are otherwise decent and normal.

From:

sharaz-jek.livejournal.com

I'm not sure he would. Harry's spent as long has he can remember in an abusive environment and then gets taken away to a magical world where people love and admire him. He's associated "being loved" with "being privileged over everyone else and encouraged to oppress those below you," and that's being reinforced by all the favouritism he's receiving. Essentially, in the wizarding world he's in Dudley's position, so he's behaving in the way he associates with that because he thinks that's how it works when people love you.

From:

aikaterini.livejournal.com

/Rowling hints at this kind of understanding when she has other characters describe young Tom Riddle, but when she actually shows him as a child, it's like she can't bear to have readers think for a moment that he might not be the most evil ill-begotten bastard who ever lived./

Yes, Tom Riddle's back-story was interesting, but it was also disappointing. He just *had* to be born evil. What a let-down.

/We were supposed to be impressed with Dumbledore for seeing through Riddle when we first heard about him in CoS, but then Rowling felt the need to beat us over the head with his undisguised nastiness, presumably so that slower readers could feel as smart and superior as Dumbledore./

And what does it say when most of the wizards that knew Tom couldn't figure out that he was evil, but "stupid" and "ignorant" Muggles could? Mrs. Cole told Dumbledore that the orphanage was ready to ship Tom off to an asylum. They had a better sense of him than the wizarding world ever did.

/Or maybe she was just afraid Riddle would acquire fangirls, which she seems to have taken it upon herself to reeducate./

Ha! XD Maybe so. But if that's true, then I'm sorry to inform her that Tom Riddle already had fangirls before HBP. And considering how many times she described his looks in HBP, I don't think that he's going to lose fangirls anytime soon.

/I wouldn't be surprised if she thinks it her public duty./

Given what she's said about Draco and Snape, I wouldn't be surprised. *sighs*

From:

dracasadiablo.livejournal.com

I don't think so.
And the Stan Shunpike thing is incredibly badly handled. If it was known that; yes, he was a DE by choice and he truly was evil it would have been much better.
That way Harry could think about everyday, pleasant to him, people that turn out to have dark natures. But we can't have our hero thinking about things or people he likes truly bad.

From:

ladyhadhafang.livejournal.com

"MALcolm BADdock, the boy with the most ominous name ever, joins Slytherin House, to the brave and bold hissing of the twins. Harry wonders if the boy knows he is joining the House that produced more Dark witches and wizards than the others. And what do you think do Slytherins think when Dennis Creevey is Sorted to Gryffindor? The House of bullies, jerks and vain peacocks?"

-Yeah, JKR, Malcolm Reynolds called; he's sick of his name being tarnished. And River Tam also called, saying to stop stealing her material.

And yeah, regarding Gryffindor...*this*. :/

From:

madderbrad.livejournal.com

... we are reminded of Parvati's twin sister, who will be needed as a date to the ball - and then forgotten.

I always liked the fanon version of Padma; someone truly beautiful - it's canon that the sisters are the "prettiest girls in Harry's year", right? - but clever too. A more serious, solid, respectable version of Parvati. Someone for Harry to fall in love with if Hermione wasn't available. Right now I'm not sure if that 'serious' demeanour is completely a fanon construct, or if there was a sentence or two somewhere in the books which gave rise to it.

The drying spell, Minerva! No such luck. Maybe it really is advanced magic.

Ha ha ha! Yes, advanced magic that needs the power of THE ELDER WAND!!

"Are you a witch or not, Minerva?" :-)

The Sorting Hat claims to have never been wrong. Yet it sometimes Sorts people 'too soon'.

Well, it's technically not wrong at the time it does the sort, then!

'Moody' drinks from his hip-flask, but eats the food served in his plate. Has the wizarding world not invented the ability to deliver poisons in food?

Hee, nice one. That excuse really didn't hold up, did it? Heaps of wizards and not an ounce of logic between them. Hermione was right! (Again)

I know: The mastermind of it all was Ludo Bagman! ...

Uhm, okay, Oryx, if you say so ...

*backs away slowly*

From:

sharaz-jek.livejournal.com

Ha ha ha! Yes, advanced magic that needs the power of THE ELDER WAND!!

My god! Hairdryers are the gift of Death himself!

From:

urbanman1984.livejournal.com

I can only assume that Moody was not all there and was suffering from PTSD from someone attempting to poison a DRINK - hence his phobia regarding drink from strangers, but not food from strangers. That is the only way it makes any kind of sense. It can just about be explained by Moody being mentally unstable.

But there is so much about this series that makes no sense at all.

From:

lynn-waterfall.livejournal.com

Right, because given the Twins' Skiving Snackboxes, worrying about drinks but not food is pretty stupid.

It *might* be easier to add a potion to another fluid as a last-minute thing, but if you're paranoid, that isn't enough of a difference.

From:

oryx_leucoryx

Uhm, okay, Oryx, if you say so ...

*backs away slowly*

It annoys me we are never given a reason why the Tournament was revived at this time. We are given reasons (even if inadequate) why Quirrell went traveling, or why Lucius released the diary just then or why Sirius broke out of Azkaban when he did after 12+ years. But the Tournament comes out of nowhere and its timing is never explained. It would have worked better to simply have it an event that still takes place every x years with the 3 schools taking turns hosting (so the previous time it was hosted at Hogwarts was 3x years previously).

From:

urbanman1984.livejournal.com

Frankly, given JKR's level of numberacy, it was just as well that she was not that ambitious!

From:

madderbrad.livejournal.com

Yes, Rowling didn't even *try* to explain it; she needed the tournament, it was there.

And yet it would have been so easy for her to put in a single sentence to make it fit properly.

But this is the woman who wrote six books with Harry defiantly saying Voldemort's name ... only to stop, never say it ONCE, after Ron begged him not to in the 7th book. Even for the weeks/months during Ron's desertion when he, Harry, was upset and angry about that desertion and not particularly disposed to grant any wish of the boy who abandoned him.

And it's the woman who had Ron justify his asking Harry not to 'say the name' because ... let me look it up ... ah, here it is:

“I’m sorry,” Ron said, moaning a little as he raised himself to look at them, “but it feels like a – a jinx or something.

Rowling really really REALLY didn't care about things like plot consistency or integrity.

(I still laugh when I read that line. It reminds me of the weekend that I read DH. When Ron made that statement I just *knew* there had to be *something* behind it. Some magical ability? A skill at divination? A super-power? WHEN WOULD IT BE REVEALED? WHEN WOULD IT BE EXPLAINED?

Because, if it wasn't explained, if there was nothing *behind* this sudden 'feeling' ... but no. There had to be something behind it.

But there wasn't. Rowling just has Ron have a 'feeling' because she needed a reason for Harry not to mention the name. And that's it.

So help me gosh, I feel *embarrassed* for her when I think of this amateurish writing!)

I'm starting to see why you say the rot started to show with GoF. Still, we can fix up this particular problem of yours, thusly:

Dumbledore cleared his throat.

"As I was saying," he said, smiling at the sea of students before him, all of whom were still gazing transfixed at Mad-Eye Moody, "we are to have the honor of hosting a very exciting event over the coming months, an event that has not been held for over a century. It is my very great pleasure to inform you that the Triwizard Tournament will be taking place at Hogwarts this year."

"You're JOKING!" said Fred Weasley loudly.

"Why NOW?" asked Harry.

"Because," said the grand old wizard, beaming down at them, "it felt like a - a good thing to do. Right now. Yes. Quite."

From:

lynn-waterfall.livejournal.com

You know, it wouldn't surprise me if JKR's reason for including it was originally just to avoid having to write the usual three Quidditch matches.

From:

oryx_leucoryx

Coming after a book with 3 Quidditch matches, this sounds believable. She still gave a detailed description of the QWC game though.

From:

lynn-waterfall.livejournal.com

Sure, but that's still only one game, and Harry doesn't have to win it. I don't think it's a coincidence that it was this time, the first game we see that Harry doesn't play in, that the Seeker who catches the snitch loses the game anyway.

Even the Quidditch World Cup's presence in the novel could well be playing to fan expectations without including more than one game.

From:

oryx_leucoryx

In OOTP Ginny catches the snitch while losing the game, but there it is described as cutting the loss caused by Ron's bad performance. And there still is the chance to undo the damage by playing well in the last game. Viktor's action makes no sportive sense.

From:

danajsparks.livejournal.com

>>>>I know: The mastermind of it all was Ludo Bagman! After all Bertha Jorkins had been working in his department. He initiated the renewal of the Triwizard tournament specifically in order to bring Voldemort back. He then gave Bertha the idea to visit Albania so that Voldemort would capture her and use her information. And yes, he got Arthur the tickets in order to give Barty Jr a chance to observe Harry from close-up. The whole business with the goblins was just a cover.

I really do love this theory. Question, though. Why was it necessary to revive the triwizard tournament in order to bring Voldemort back? It's hard enough to explain why they even included it at all in their plot.

Oh... maybe that's the plot-hole she fell into, and that's why Bagman's story-line was dropped.

From:

sunnyskywalker

There was also the Weasley cousin (daughter of the Squib accountant turned out to be a witch) who got cut. Maybe it wasn't so much a plot hole as a giant plot cliff where all the subplots went to die.

From:

oryx_leucoryx

Why was it necessary to revive the triwizard tournament in order to bring Voldemort back?

It wasn't, but it provided a continuous source of drama all year, a host of red herrings (Igor, Ludo, maybe Viktor) and all the romantic shenanigans.

Without the Tournament Peter would have still encountered Bertha in Albania, she would have still yielded the info on Barty, who would have still showed up as impersonator of whoever the DADA instructor would have been (but Moody works best). He would have taught Harry nifty DADA tricks to earn his trust. Would have still tormented sons of DEs and Severus because he still hates DEs who walked free (and to buy Harry's undying love, of course). Let's assume that normally Hogwarts is protected from Portkeying, so his plan would have been to send Harry to Tom from Hogsmeade. He would try to get Harry alone each Hogsmeade weekend under some excuse or other but something would turn up until the plan finally works in late spring. Severus would be suspicious and try to interfere but Harry would think it's because he is jealous of the DADA teacher or because the DADA teacher is causing trouble to Slytherins.

From:

danajsparks.livejournal.com

It wasn't, but it provided a continuous source of drama all year, a host of red herrings (Igor, Ludo, maybe Viktor) and all the romantic shenanigans.

Right, I get that. But what would be the Watsonian explanation for why Ludo would revive the tournament as part of bringing back Voldemort?

From:

oryx_leucoryx

We know Albus was having trouble finding DADA teachers - Gilderoy had no rival candidates (aside from Severus, of course). So Ludo knew that like in Y3 Albus would be hiring a member of his circle, someone indebted to him. Of those people, the one most similar to young Barty, the one Barty would find it easiest impersonating was Moody. So how can Ludo manipulate Albus into hiring Moody (rather than, say, Emmeline Vance, Dedalus Diggle or whoever)? By using his position as department head to arrange for an event likely to draw much attention to Hogwarts and to bring there suspicious people such as Igor. If Albus thinks Hogwarts is in potential danger of infiltration then an ex-Auror is more likely to be taken as DADA instructor than an ex-Order member with less professional experience in security and detective work.

From:

danajsparks.livejournal.com

that works! :D

I was thinking that maybe the tournament has some kind of significance that's long been forgotten, like it's some kind of magic ritual, or something, and so that's why Voldemort wanted Harry to go through it before facing him.

But there's not really anything within canon to support that.