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deathtocapslock2022-09-10 12:07 pm
sunnyskywalker) wrote in deathtocapslock2022-09-10 12:07 pm
Voldemort's favorite Death Eaters
A lot of fanon assumes that because Lucius, Severus, and Bellatrix are very important during the second war, they must have been so during the first. Lucius was especially trusted and valued because Voldemort gave him the diary and told him so much about it. Similarly, Bellatrix was exceptionally trusted and important because he told her all about the Horcrux he gave her to guard. Severus was important because he got assigned a special mission at Hogwarts. But does any of that that hold up? Not very well, in my opinion.
We know the most about how Regulus’s experience as a Horcrux-guardian, and it shows the opposite: Voldemort didn’t tell him anything. All he did was demand the use of the family house-elf. Whom he didn’t even intend to return. If he didn’t explain why he wanted an elf beforehand, I doubt he planned to tell Regulus after the fact, when Regulus asked whether the family’s beloved servant was finished with his mysterious task yet. “He died furthering my goals. Isn’t it an honor?” was probably about it. This doesn’t exactly suggest that he valued Regulus (at least not as anything more than a trophy), and definitely doesn’t indicate trust. So why assume he thought vastly better of Lucius or Bellatrix?
I’ve already examined how much Lucius may or may not have known about the diary and Voldemort, and how much of that he may have learned (or speculated) on his own versus learning it directly from Voldemort. I think it’s most likely that Voldemort didn't trust Lucius any more than he had Regulus and was parsimonious with his explanations.
Really, all Lucius had to do was play messenger-boy. Accepting that Lucius has enough basic competence to keep an enchanted diary he doesn’t fully understand safe for a few weeks or months before handing it off requires a little trust, but not that Lucius be a top-level lieutenant and confidant. Especially if Voldemort chose Lucius partly for his known friendship with recent-Hogwarts-hire Severus, which gave the two of them a plausible reason to meet at the Hog’s Head some Friday night for the hand-off, rather than on his own merits.
What about Bellatrix? We don’t actually know what she knew about the cup other than that it was extremely valuable to the Dark Lord. “His most precious—” something. But the cup of Helga Hufflepuff, one of the four Founders of Hogwarts, has enormous historical and propaganda value, plus fabulous magical properties (according to Hepzibah). If someone handed you a relic of Benjamin Franklin’s which was also intrinsically valuable and fabulously magical, you wouldn’t feel a need to look for secret extra reasons someone would value it. “It’s Helga’s cup” is more than enough to convince Bellatrix that the cup is very, very important without throwing Horcruxification into the mix. This goes double for a sword which is just one tier down on the “famous magical British swords list” from Excalibur. Plus, Voldemort expects his followers to obey him regardless of whether they understand his orders, and Bellatrix accepts this. If he says it’s important, it’s important.
If she does know that it’s a Horcrux, that prompts the same question as for Lucius and the diary: did Voldemort tell her, or did she find out on her own? Whatever books in the Black family library let Regulus figure it out were surely accessible to Bellatrix too, so she could have worked it out on her own.
She doesn’t need to know about Horcruxes to believe that Voldemort isn’t dead and could be found and revived. Voldemort claims that all of his Death Eaters all knew he was alive (none of them claim otherwise as a defense), and that he’d told them something to explain his deathlessness — something which wasn’t Horcruxes, because Severus had never heard of those until Dumbledore explained. Bellatrix has no reason to doubt that when Voldemort says he can’t be killed, it’s true. Especially not if her Dark Mark has enough weak existence to prove that Voldemort is still around in some fashion.
Also, he didn’t trust Bellatrix with the cup’s protection: he trusted Gringotts. The bank which is allegedly impossible to break into. (Voldemort hadn’t yet tried to rob Gringotts when he gave the cup to Bella and didn’t know how overblown their security reputation was. Even later, he may have thought he was the only one who could pull it off, as he thought he was the only one who found the Room of Hidden Things.) Harry can spin stories about Voldemort feeling like access to a Gringotts bank vault makes him a real wizard or whatever all he likes, and maybe he’s even right, but that doesn’t mean it’s Voldemort’s primary motive. “No one will be able to break in and steal it” is a pretty good motive all by itself.
So, sure, maybe Voldemort told Bella everything. But maybe he told her nothing more than the obvious: this is Helga Hufflepuff’s magic cup, which will be safer in a bank vault.
What we actually know is this: in the one case where we know how much he explained to his follower about the Horcrux — Regulus — the answer is “nothing.” He didn’t care enough to so much as warn Regulus ahead of time that he intended to kill the family’s faithful servant. And he didn’t trust any of his followers to create the protections for his Horcruxes. At most, he allowed them to handle the Horcruxes long enough to pass them on.
No, Voldemort didn’t trust his Horcrux-guardians.
What about special missions? Does sending Severus into Hogwarts prove that Voldemort valued him?
Well, his mission was probably to assassinate Dumbledore. We know how much he valued Draco when he assigned Draco that mission. And he told Severus to apply for the cursed DADA position. Did he care what would happen to Severus by the end of the year? He doesn’t seem bothered that his most loyal servant Barty Junior didn’t survive his Hogwarts mission, and that’s when loyal, competent followers are much thinner on the ground.
It’s possible that Severus’s “value” is what makes him an odd man out in the Death Eaters: his background. Voldemort probably always wanted a few followers who could serve as spies and assassins when needed. He can’t plant someone like Evan Rosier at Hogwarts. Dumbledore might have a reputation (deserved or not) for giving second chances, but would even he trust a second-generation Death Eater and Slytherin alumnus from an anti-Dumbledore family who claimed a change of heart? Enough to give the guy a job? (Probably, but Voldemort might not have known back then how reckless Dumbledore’s hiring decisions could be.) No, more convincing would be, say, a half-blood with no money or social status who’d once been friends with a Muggle-born. Someone who could plausibly claim that he’d realized his pureblood friends were using him and would never consider him an equal. Guilt over endangering a former friend was an unexpected but useful addition to the cover story. (Too bad for Voldemort that this turned out to be, not just plausible, but true.) Voldemort obviously didn’t value Severus’s other talents so highly that he minded losing the young man to a probable suicide mission. Severus was valuable precisely because of his disposability.
It’s possible that his situation was even closer to Draco’s. Voldemort might have known about the secret tunnels between Hogwarts and Hogsmeade and the Vanishing Cabinet with its pair in Borgin and Burkes. If so, he could have sneaked into Hogwarts to kill Dumbledore any time he wanted. It’s possible that he didn’t expect Severus to succeed, but placed him there as a fall guy (by making him plant the diary on a student and then failing to kill Dumbledore) or to dispose of an inconveniently-sharp follower via the curse.
I think that during the first war, Severus was kept somewhat apart and carefully cultivated to ensure that he didn’t realize he was disposable until the last minute, Bellatrix was a pet/attack dog but not the top dog, and Lucius was middle management. They’re important during the second war mostly because so many other Death Eaters died in battle or in Azkaban that they’re the most competent ones still standing. If their status rose during the first war, it wasn’t until very near the end.
We know the most about how Regulus’s experience as a Horcrux-guardian, and it shows the opposite: Voldemort didn’t tell him anything. All he did was demand the use of the family house-elf. Whom he didn’t even intend to return. If he didn’t explain why he wanted an elf beforehand, I doubt he planned to tell Regulus after the fact, when Regulus asked whether the family’s beloved servant was finished with his mysterious task yet. “He died furthering my goals. Isn’t it an honor?” was probably about it. This doesn’t exactly suggest that he valued Regulus (at least not as anything more than a trophy), and definitely doesn’t indicate trust. So why assume he thought vastly better of Lucius or Bellatrix?
I’ve already examined how much Lucius may or may not have known about the diary and Voldemort, and how much of that he may have learned (or speculated) on his own versus learning it directly from Voldemort. I think it’s most likely that Voldemort didn't trust Lucius any more than he had Regulus and was parsimonious with his explanations.
Really, all Lucius had to do was play messenger-boy. Accepting that Lucius has enough basic competence to keep an enchanted diary he doesn’t fully understand safe for a few weeks or months before handing it off requires a little trust, but not that Lucius be a top-level lieutenant and confidant. Especially if Voldemort chose Lucius partly for his known friendship with recent-Hogwarts-hire Severus, which gave the two of them a plausible reason to meet at the Hog’s Head some Friday night for the hand-off, rather than on his own merits.
What about Bellatrix? We don’t actually know what she knew about the cup other than that it was extremely valuable to the Dark Lord. “His most precious—” something. But the cup of Helga Hufflepuff, one of the four Founders of Hogwarts, has enormous historical and propaganda value, plus fabulous magical properties (according to Hepzibah). If someone handed you a relic of Benjamin Franklin’s which was also intrinsically valuable and fabulously magical, you wouldn’t feel a need to look for secret extra reasons someone would value it. “It’s Helga’s cup” is more than enough to convince Bellatrix that the cup is very, very important without throwing Horcruxification into the mix. This goes double for a sword which is just one tier down on the “famous magical British swords list” from Excalibur. Plus, Voldemort expects his followers to obey him regardless of whether they understand his orders, and Bellatrix accepts this. If he says it’s important, it’s important.
If she does know that it’s a Horcrux, that prompts the same question as for Lucius and the diary: did Voldemort tell her, or did she find out on her own? Whatever books in the Black family library let Regulus figure it out were surely accessible to Bellatrix too, so she could have worked it out on her own.
She doesn’t need to know about Horcruxes to believe that Voldemort isn’t dead and could be found and revived. Voldemort claims that all of his Death Eaters all knew he was alive (none of them claim otherwise as a defense), and that he’d told them something to explain his deathlessness — something which wasn’t Horcruxes, because Severus had never heard of those until Dumbledore explained. Bellatrix has no reason to doubt that when Voldemort says he can’t be killed, it’s true. Especially not if her Dark Mark has enough weak existence to prove that Voldemort is still around in some fashion.
Also, he didn’t trust Bellatrix with the cup’s protection: he trusted Gringotts. The bank which is allegedly impossible to break into. (Voldemort hadn’t yet tried to rob Gringotts when he gave the cup to Bella and didn’t know how overblown their security reputation was. Even later, he may have thought he was the only one who could pull it off, as he thought he was the only one who found the Room of Hidden Things.) Harry can spin stories about Voldemort feeling like access to a Gringotts bank vault makes him a real wizard or whatever all he likes, and maybe he’s even right, but that doesn’t mean it’s Voldemort’s primary motive. “No one will be able to break in and steal it” is a pretty good motive all by itself.
So, sure, maybe Voldemort told Bella everything. But maybe he told her nothing more than the obvious: this is Helga Hufflepuff’s magic cup, which will be safer in a bank vault.
What we actually know is this: in the one case where we know how much he explained to his follower about the Horcrux — Regulus — the answer is “nothing.” He didn’t care enough to so much as warn Regulus ahead of time that he intended to kill the family’s faithful servant. And he didn’t trust any of his followers to create the protections for his Horcruxes. At most, he allowed them to handle the Horcruxes long enough to pass them on.
No, Voldemort didn’t trust his Horcrux-guardians.
What about special missions? Does sending Severus into Hogwarts prove that Voldemort valued him?
Well, his mission was probably to assassinate Dumbledore. We know how much he valued Draco when he assigned Draco that mission. And he told Severus to apply for the cursed DADA position. Did he care what would happen to Severus by the end of the year? He doesn’t seem bothered that his most loyal servant Barty Junior didn’t survive his Hogwarts mission, and that’s when loyal, competent followers are much thinner on the ground.
It’s possible that Severus’s “value” is what makes him an odd man out in the Death Eaters: his background. Voldemort probably always wanted a few followers who could serve as spies and assassins when needed. He can’t plant someone like Evan Rosier at Hogwarts. Dumbledore might have a reputation (deserved or not) for giving second chances, but would even he trust a second-generation Death Eater and Slytherin alumnus from an anti-Dumbledore family who claimed a change of heart? Enough to give the guy a job? (Probably, but Voldemort might not have known back then how reckless Dumbledore’s hiring decisions could be.) No, more convincing would be, say, a half-blood with no money or social status who’d once been friends with a Muggle-born. Someone who could plausibly claim that he’d realized his pureblood friends were using him and would never consider him an equal. Guilt over endangering a former friend was an unexpected but useful addition to the cover story. (Too bad for Voldemort that this turned out to be, not just plausible, but true.) Voldemort obviously didn’t value Severus’s other talents so highly that he minded losing the young man to a probable suicide mission. Severus was valuable precisely because of his disposability.
It’s possible that his situation was even closer to Draco’s. Voldemort might have known about the secret tunnels between Hogwarts and Hogsmeade and the Vanishing Cabinet with its pair in Borgin and Burkes. If so, he could have sneaked into Hogwarts to kill Dumbledore any time he wanted. It’s possible that he didn’t expect Severus to succeed, but placed him there as a fall guy (by making him plant the diary on a student and then failing to kill Dumbledore) or to dispose of an inconveniently-sharp follower via the curse.
I think that during the first war, Severus was kept somewhat apart and carefully cultivated to ensure that he didn’t realize he was disposable until the last minute, Bellatrix was a pet/attack dog but not the top dog, and Lucius was middle management. They’re important during the second war mostly because so many other Death Eaters died in battle or in Azkaban that they’re the most competent ones still standing. If their status rose during the first war, it wasn’t until very near the end.
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Lucius obviously didn't know what the diary really was. If he had would he have sent it to Hogwarts with Ginny? I don't think so.
Since Severus and Lucius stayed out of Azkaban they are also one of the few relatively sane Death Eaters.
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Regarding Lucius, we see when the DEs gather at the end of GOF there are 2 that speak of their own initiative - Avery, begging for forgiveness - he gets tortured by Tom; and Lucius - asking for the details of Tom's survival - he gets exposition, and no torture. This suggests Lucius was the highest ranking DE among those in the gathering - those that survived and avoided imprisonment.
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I think Lucius got his de facto promotion quite late in the war. Most of Tom's original followers and possible early followers, like the elder Rosier, elder Mulciber, and possibly elder Lestrange and elder Avery seem to have died or gone to prison before Tom's fall. (We don't know whether Cygnus Black was a Death Eater, or if he was, whether he died in 1992 or 1979, since the date is different on different drafts of the quasi-canonical tapestry.) Most deaths and captures seem to have happened after 1979, so it probably isn't too much of a stretch to attribute these arrests and deaths to the 1979-1982 period, to include the mop-up afterward. Lucius might have found himself one of the highest-ranking DEs left when it came time to organize their Imperius defenses and took over the remains of a couple of other cells.
I am curious about the role of old Nott, who did survive and walk free and show up at the graveyard. He's one of the original followers and the Notts are supposed to be on the same social level as the Malfoys, but he keeps strictly to the background other than a smidge of groveling when Voldemort calls on him directly. Did he just never show leadership potential and has been a foot soldier all this time? Is he in disgrace for some reason? Voldemort lumps Nott in with the elder Crabbe and Goyle, who are supposed to "do better this time." Maybe he got demoted. Or maybe (after decades longer with Voldemort) he's more cautious than Lucius, who hasn't learned to keep his mouth shut yet.
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I think Lucius got his de facto promotion quite late in the war.
Or possibly even after. The Lestranges' and many other arrests only happened after the first war after all. And while Voldemort has only come back fully that night, he has spent the last year with Pettigrew updating him on the state of the world and his followers. And not many of those still held much power.
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Even some of those who stayed free might have been senior but died between 1981 and 1995. The Black family tree suggests that something happened from 1990 to 1992 to kill around four of their not-so-elderly members. Maybe a dragonpox epidemic which also carried off Abraxas Malfoy? And--depending on which version of the family tree you're looking at--one of the Blacks who died might have been Cygnus, father of Bellatrix and in-law of the Rosiers. (The other version has him dying in 1979, in which case we have to wonder about war deaths or whether there was another dragonpox epidemic from 1977-1979 that carried him off along with Orion and all the remaining Potters except James.) He might have been the one who recruited Lucius in the first place, and senior to him.
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Before I comment on anything else: are we certain Voldemort asked Bella to hide the Cup in her vault at Gringotts? Because to me, it doesn't sound like a good place to hide Horcrux. Sure it's less accessible than for example Gaunt's ring location, but what happens when Bella, Rodolphus and Rabastan die in combat? Do the contents of the vault go to Narcissa? Somebody else? Do Goblins raid the vault for any goblin-made artefacts before giving the rest to the family of the deceased? Too much risk with Tom lacking enough control over the situation to feel secure.
Also are we sure Gringotts had that great reputation? We learn about its reputation from Hagrid out of all people. For all we know there were multiple break-ins over the years but goblins are great at covering it up and... retrieving the goods.
As for the true status of Horcrux guardians... I have to wonder what Voldemort's plans for recovering from death were before he went after Potters. I mean he actively participated in raids in era where Aurors were permitted to use Unforgivables. With how obsessed he was with not dying he had to have some game plan for any unplanned body destructions. Is this why he was so mad at DEs in GOF for not searching him out after he had a frontal collision with Potter luck? He had passed some vague orders to his generals just-in-case and they failed to follow them?
Lucius strikes me as too much out for his and his family's interest to be a reliable high-ranking officer. But then again maybe that is why Voldemort doesn't have any trusted followers- he recruited from Slytherin and then realised he should have gone for Hufflepuffs?
Anyway back to the subject. IMHO Lucius got Diary for three reasons: 1) deploying a weapon, 2) potentially taking fall if the plan failed and 3) temporary safekeeping. I'm baffled that Voldemort wanted to risk a piece of his soul for not that good plan, but I guess at that point he was insane and overconfident enough to want to pull something like that.
With Bella... considering how loyal she is I think he trusts her, but in the same capacity, you would trust a talking dog. She can follow orders to a point and won't try to backstab him, but giving her too much information would confuse her priorities. Besides what Bella doesn't know, can't be extracted with Veritaserum.
Severus, I think he trusted even less than Lucious. Severus is too talented for his own good and Voldemort might have seen him as future competition. A half-blood Slytherin from a troubled background and talented in both potion AND spell creation? That had to hit a bit too close to home. But he was a bit too useful to just kill him off and be done with, so he send him on a suicide mission.
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If the goblins quietly retrieved any stolen money and items, they probably covered it up well enough that Gringotts did indeed still have a reputation for being un-robbable, even if it was unwarranted. (I bet none of the thieves were ever seen again.) Until someone reported the break-in at Vault 713. Who did that, anyway? I can't see the goblins announcing it on their own initiative, especially when nothing had been stolen. Quirrell? Voldemort probably didn't want him drawing the attention. Dumbledore? Hm...
Maybe the plan in Voldemort's head was something like this: have messenger-boy Lucius give Severus the diary some Friday night with instructions to pass it to a student with a compulsion to write in it. (Tell them both they will understand the full honor of this seemingly trivial task in time, mwahaha.) Let the chaos build for a little while. Then send Severus a message: DE spies confirm that Dumbledore said something to his Ministry or Wizengamot friends that strongly suggests he knows Severus is behind it. To save them all, Severus has to kill Dumbledore immediately.
Then Voldemort plans for multiple possible outcomes.
What he plans if Severus fails to kill Dumbledore, isn't caught, and Dumbledore keeps him on anyway, I don't know. Try again later? He probably doesn't plan for the possibility of Severus not planting the diary on a kid at all.
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What he plans if Severus fails to kill Dumbledore, isn't caught, and Dumbledore keeps him on anyway, I don't know. Try again later? He probably doesn't plan for the possibility of Severus not planting the diary on a kid at all.
Voldemort: So how killing Dumbledore is going?
Severus: aggressively sweats Fantastic, my Lord! I just need to finish brewing the potion!
In all seriousness, I don't think Severus would own up if he failed to kill Albus, but wasn't caught. I wonder if VV1 era Severus would have the balls to plant diary on kid and then cast compulsion on the kid to deliver it to Albus. Technically he did what he was asked: diary planted on a kid? ✅ compulsion casted? ✅ but the kid just happened to have concerned friends who dragged them to Dumbledore, My Lord!
As for break-in in Vault 713... that is a real headscratcher for me. Goblins have no interest in informing the public about it. Even if there are no other banks in WW UK, you can always decide to hide your earnings in a cellar under your house. Which wouldn't be particularly smart, but wizards aren't smart. Dumbledore? How would he know about the break-in? Nothing was stolen from it because it was empty after Hagrid retrieved PS. Again Goblins wouldn't care to inform him about the break-in.
But I have 2 theories about how this story leaked out: either one of the human employees blabbed and was later... dealt with by the pissed-off employer, or animagi transformation is more common among journalists than we suspected.
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Or hey, we don't need a second animagus journalist if we assume that Rita had already managed it by 1991. She would love a story like that. Though she might have been wary of pissing off the goblins by publishing. Maybe she made sure one of her less-careful rivals got the information anonymously and let the goblins explain their displeasure to that person.
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He doesn't seem to have expected that they could instantly locate him if he not-died, so whatever he planned wasn't heading to a location where he'd stashed a magical tracking device connected to their Dark Marks and waiting until someone came to restore him. Maybe he told them to go to a certain place where he'd leave a clue, which would lead them to another place with another clue, and several more steps to find him? (Multiple layers of security so even if someone betrayed the first location, the Aurors couldn't hop straight to Voldemort's hideout.) And their excuse was that, um, they never were good at those sorts of puzzles, my lord... And maybe the Longbottoms did find the first location, because Karkaroff, Rookwood, and/or Severus had betrayed it, and that's why the Lestranges went after them? To get the first clue?
He'd told his followers something to account for his deathlessness which wasn't Horcruxes. "Steps" he'd taken. I suspect that at least some of these were magical enhancements to his body that protected him from many forms of magical damage (and this is what really changed his appearance so much). Maybe Incendio and Diffindo just bounced right off his skin and left him undamaged. That would freak people out and convince them that he just might not be kidding about being immortal.
But he might not have told them that if he needed resurrecting, it would be because he'd been separated from or lost his body, even if he knew that himself. I'm not sure it's clear in retrospect that everyone knew Voldemort's entire body was vaporized on Halloween. We heard that he "fled" and that his "powers were broken," that there wasn't enough left of him to return. But I'm not sure we knew that he was actually bodiless until Voldemort explained that from the back of Quirrell's head, and that information wasn't exactly widely shared, was it? (Sure, Dumbledore says everyone knows what happened, but we later find out that isn't true. Neville knows about the "sorcerous/philologial" stone, but apparently not that Voldemort was a wraith possessing Quirrell--and he was one of the best-informed outsiders. What did everyone else "know"?) So what did they think broken powers meant, exactly? That he was badly injured and managed to Portkey away or something, but had somehow lost control of his magic and wouldn't be useful for anything again? How? Maybe they thought he drank unicorn blood then to survive, and unicorn blood weakens wizard magic? That would probably count as a cursed half-life to wizards... Whatever it was, apparently most of them thought or hoped that he was permanently too weak now to do anything, so they didn't look, because what's he going to do to them now if they don't? If he really could be restored, wouldn't he have managed it himself by now?
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Oh boy, I just imagined Lucius, Lestranges, Barty and Severus trying to solve puzzles to find Voldy-wraith. Lucius really isn't interested in being there but his sister-in-law threatened she will cut off his balls if he doesn't join the party. Meanwhile, Severus subtly tries to sabotage more devoted DEs so they won't solve the puzzles. I had a good laugh, thanks!
And Severus tipping Albus off on the potential location of this device would explain how Albus knew Tom was floating around in Albania. Might even explain the holes in the timeline- why Harry was placed over 24h after the incident on Petunia's doorstep? Why Lestranges attacked Longbottoms on 4th or 5th (?) November? Albus stealing the device just after the attack on Potters or even before it, would explain some of those issues 🤔
I don't think he would tell them his body can be destroyed- that could encourage someone to attempt destroying it. Or even it might have tipped off someone what he used to secure his immortality. But he HAD to tell them something so they would know they need to search him out instead of focusing on covering their asses.
The "he fled" and "powers were broken" never sat well with me. Not only it sounds like something from Tolkien's works, but also after we learn just how nasty the VV1 was I can't believe that someone like for example Amelia Bones wouldn't go hunting for him. A society full of torn families and potentially Squib Dark Lord? There would be a manhunt for him. After all WW UK believes that putting (sometimes even without a trial) a person in prison with soul-sucking, happiness-erasing monsters is justice. And Voldemort did way too much for them to let him walk away unless he was beyond their reach.
I think that most wizards and witches don't know about Voldemort's robe being left in Potters' house. If I had to make a guess I would say they think that whatever Lily and James did to protect Harry obliterated Tom whole- body, soul and magic. Albus probably said Voldemort is "gone" (because that man loves playing word games) and with fading DEs' marks everybody assumed it meant "dead".
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"A revolver, Lucius. I do apologize. I should have realized the reference would be over your head."
The Longbottoms might have been attacked much later, even. It was "when everyone was starting to feel safe again," which sounds more like weeks or months than days. But it might have taken the Lestranges that long to work out which of Dumbledore's followers had/knew whatever it was.
Fudge said that he believed Voldemort to be out there somewhere in that conversation with Rosmerta, Hagrid, McGonagall, and Flitwick. He shuddered to think how quickly Voldemort would rise again once Sirius Black found him and did...something...to restore him. But maybe it's only certain Ministry officials and Dumbledore's followers who know enough to suspect this, and everyone else is pretty sure or at least really hopes he's dead? But you're right, I can't see Amelia Bones going, "Oh well, let's leave him alone and let him get a job digging ditches or something, probably be good for him." Did they think he had an unfindable, impenetrable fortress somewhere, but he was stuck there so it was as good as a prison? I wouldn't count on it in their place. Did they hunt for years and only recently give up, figuring that if he could come back, he would have already? Maybe they thought he just took a while to die of his injuries?
Or maybe Fudge only believes it on Dumbledore's word in the first place, and the shenanigans at the end of the book are what convince him that maybe Dumbledore's been exaggerating a bit?
I don't think anyone except the DEs themselves and Dumbledore knew about the dark mark brands, though, so that wouldn't factor into what everyone thought one way or another.
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I don't think anyone except the DEs themselves and Dumbledore knew about the dark mark brands, though, so that wouldn't factor into what everyone thought one way or another.
Didn't Severus show off his dark mark to Fudge at the end of GOF to prove Voldemort is back? Or am I misremembering something?
Fudge shuddering to think about Voldemort's rise thanks to Sirius, might be his attempt at rubbing elbows with Dumbledore's staff. He knows they at the very least know about Albus' stance on Voldemort's current status. And with all MOM's screw-ups we see in PoA alone I can see a politician trying to chat up influential members of society to rise popular opinion of him.
Especially since only year later Fudge's first reaction to Voldemort's supposed resurrection is "He is dead!" (or something like that). We know from PS that according to our local alchemy and blood magic expert people don't come back from death. Which if it's common knowledge it would explain why everybody disbelieved Harry. Yeah, part of this probably was a genuine fear that somehow Voldemort managed to break even the most basic rule of magic, but Dumbledore's lack of any evidence and secretiveness around anything connected to Voldemort would automatically rise multiple eyebrows.
no subject
It all seems more consistent with a mark that can be hidden and therefore isn't publicly known, and which Sirius would therefore accept Dumbledore couldn't tell them about without revealing that he had a spy he didn't want Voldemort to hear about. So no, I don't think anyone but Voldemort, Dumbledore (and maybe Moody), and the Death Eaters knew about the Dark Mark brands before June 1995, when Severus told Fudge in front of the kids. And the general public may still not have known until the Death Eater takeover in 1997.
I don't have access to the books right now, so I'm not sure whether Hagrid's Voldemort 101 speech in the first book had the line "some say he died" in the books as well as the movie, but I think it did? Maybe by "some," he meant "everyone who isn't one of Dumbledore's Men"?