deathtocapslock | HBP: Chapter 4: Welcome to the Harry & Dumbledore Show!

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HBP: Chapter 4: Welcome to the Harry & Dumbledore Show!

In Which Dumbledore shows how good he is at manipulating people while putting an eccentric front.

- Right off the bat, the link between Harry and Voldemort is severed, as V is ~~tired of listening so much teen angst and is therefore~~ applying Occlumency against him. Harry, for one, is not missing the flashes of insight into Voldemort's mind, which a)proves that he gives higher priority to his needs than the needs of others, and b)serves as ironic foreshadowing.

- Harry's impression of Apparition sounds a bit like being forced back into the womb. When Dumbledore asks him how it was, Harry replies, and I quote, "I'm fine. But I think I might prefer brooms..." Meanwhile, HP slashers file this as Evidence #183.

- Harry: "Professor, why couldn't we just Apparate directly into your old colleague's house?"
Dumbledore: "Because it would be quite as rude as kicking down the front door. Courtesy dictates that we offer fellow wizards the opportunity of denying us entry."

Given that there have been a couple of GoF re-reads elsewhere lately, surely we're all wondering, "and what about when the Weasleys used the Dursleys' fireplace without permission?" Of course, Dumbledore covered that part already with the "fellow wizards" bit. Or maybe the Weasleys are just that rude.

- Dumbledore gives Harry (and us) the definition for Inferi. While it might sound a bit like zombies, remember that saying Inferi are just zombies will cause Snape to Apparate on the spot, verbally bitchslap you and go on a 10-minute diatribe on just how Inferi are different from zombies.

- "There was no need to stick the wand in that hard," he said gruffly, clambering to his feet. "It hurt." I hereby declare this to be the single dirtiest line in HP canon.

- Let me get on the record that I like Slughorn as a character. Yes, he's a bit creepy in that pedo kind of way, and yes, the constant harping on his weight gets old faster than on nearly anyone else (probably because Vernon and Dudley, our resident fat stereotypes, only appear a couple chapters per book on average), but he's probably the only character on the series who treats Dumbledore as an equal and not as some sort of father figure to worship or to rebel against. Plus, he's living proof that Harry is prejudiced against the Slytherins.

- Harry and Dumbledore have a heart-to-heart inside the Weasley broom-shed (this is where I point out how dirty that sounds) regarding the tragic parting of Sirius Black. Here we learn that after moping his way through the last chapter of OotP and the two interim weeks, Harry has decided to choose life and live. Dumbledore commends him on his choice, noting that Sirius is dead but their love lives on. H/D shippers ponder whether love can bloom, even on the battlefield. [/extended MGS reference]

- Harry mentions how Sirius wouldn't have wanted him to mourn his loss for long; he would have wanted Harry to find someone with whom to vicariously relive their loving relationship of sending each other mail and making Angst competitions.

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For some reason, on re-read Slughorn reminds me of Withnail & I's Uncle Monty, though not as pathetic. I can still see Stephen Fry portraying him in the film, however (although he won't do the movies and that's probably really smart of him!), especially when I read lines like "It's quite easy once you know how, one simple Freezing Charm on these absurd burglar alarms they use instead of Sneakoscopes and make sure the neighbors don't spot you bringing in the piano."

Dumbledore gives Harry (and us) the definition for Inferi. While it might sound a bit like zombies, remember that saying Inferi are just zombies will cause Snape to Apparate on the spot, verbally bitchslap you and go on a 10-minute diatribe on just how Inferi are different from zombies.

Oh that sounds exciting. I could use a bit of that this morning, since the coffee isn't kicking in. "Please note, Miss Q_Spade, that Inferi DO NOT eat brains. Certainly not HUMAN brains, the majority being of inferior nutritional quality these days and would barely satisfy a tick."

Stephen Fry is too young to play Slughorn. Clearly, Brian Blessed is the only correct choice. The Sluggy "Oho!" must be done in the Brian Blessed voice :)

If only Richard Griffiths wasn't already playing Vernon Dursley. I can see what everyone means about Uncle Monty. Should have looked ahead, eh?

Clearly, Brian Blessed is the only correct choice. The Sluggy "Oho!" must be done in the Brian Blessed voice :)

I remember you mentioned Blessed last time – I really do have to agree that he'd be a great choice. :D

As Richard Griffiths would have...ah well. I'll have to refrain from reading the upcoming scenes between Slughorn and Harry and thinking of Monty's pursuit of Marwood..."I mean to have you, boy – even if it must be burglary!"

"There was no need to stick the wand in that hard," he said gruffly, clambering to his feet. "It hurt." I hereby declare this to be the single dirtiest line in HP canon.
I second that feel. Ugh.

Man, Dumbledore just becomes creepier by the ~~minute~~ chapter which... considering the other five books, is quite an achievement. And people are creeped out by Slughorn? WTF. ~~That is is exactly the same reason I can`t understand why people on the LOST fandom are so incredibly creeped by Locke when there`s controlfreakmywordislaw!Jack on the loose...~~

There's no reason why people can't be creeped out by both. Slughorn reminds me of real people I've met. It's a kind of low-grade creepy rather than Dumbledore's Evil SuperVillain style, which is probably much worse and rather harder to avoid :(

Oh, of course, people can be creeped out by both - I totally understand the low-grade creepy factor you`re talking about. I find it in other characters, just not in Slughorn - guess it´s all about what puts you off and what doesn`t.

What I meant is that Slughorn (who`s a clearly "what you is what you get" perv) seems to cause such a level of digust while Dumbledore who, imo, is far more creepy and displays almost sociopathic tendencies is never even regarded as manipulative by most of Fandom. This troubles me.

Maybe my problem is that Dumbledore reminds me of certain RL (and much beloved, just like Dumbledore, by a high percentage of people) megalomaniac world leaders that have almost the entire world population`s present and future in their hands... As Dumbledore seems to have the WW`s.

Slughorn may not seem so creepy by comparison, but people who take the authorial voice by its word aren't likely to see anything wrong with Dumbledore, so...

I thought the Weasley's weren't rude so much as ignorant. They assume that since most (all?) Wizards use their fireplaces as part of the Floo network that the Muggles would also. They were also expected, and the Dursleys hadn't gone to great lengths to evade detection, like stage a burglery/murder to avoid their guests. The real irony there is that Dumbledore forced his way into the Dursley house, threatened and insulted his "hosts," and then talks about the etiquette of not barging in. He certainly didn't allow the Dursley's to deny him entry.

I thought Slughorn was creepy in that he cultivates sycophants who are children. All people are susceptible to flattery, but children especially. He's training them to use their fantastic suck-up powers to get ahead in life.

However, I totally love the ends even if I don't approve of the means. I, also, like to be in the center of attention and make deals and do favors and get presents from people who looooove me and my influence, so I'm not judging him too harshly.

He certainly didn't allow the Dursley's to deny him entry.

Word.

I thought Slughorn was creepy in that he cultivates sycophants who are children.

Heh. I think that's why he reminds people of Dumbledore!

I thought Slughorn was creepy in that he cultivates sycophants who are children.

Heh. I think that's why he reminds people of Dumbledore!

Agreed – Dumbledore is certainly cultivating Harry as a sycophant (and rather successfully, as we find out in a chapter or so!). In fact, Dumbles insists that Harry use his "fantastic suck-up powers to get ahead"* with Slughorn at various points throughout the book.

Slughorn's definitely more blatant & obnoxious about picking favorite kids and hitching his wagon to their stars...but he doesn't bring love and destiny into the equation the way Dumbles does with Harry.

*Love that turn of phrase! :)

I think the big difference between Slughorn and Dumblydore is that Slughorn says "You should love me because I can be of use to you" whereas Dumbledore says "You should love me."

Slughorn: "OHO! I can be very useful to you! And you to me!"

Dumbles: "You can be very useful to me. So, of course, let us assume you will be."

Now, Dumbledore assumes/believes that he is working for The Common Good. Therefore, what is good for him is good for everyone. He's the good guy, the defender of the innocent and the weak, the teacher, The Only One Voldemort Fears. It goes without saying that what's good for him is good for those who are good to him.

I don't know if that's arrogance, very scary, or both.

And more and more, that kind of attitude is present in the younger students: Harry and Hermione both seem to have the mindset that anything they do is justifiable, since they're on the 'good' side (as well as Fred, George, Ginny and some of the other DA members.) and that insisting that even minor/unrelated matters must be to their liking at all times is acceptable.

Dumbledore is just sooo cool and powerful and impressive and wacky and authoritative that kids can't help but looooove him.

Slughorn puts on teas and encourages children to vie for his affection... or at least act like they like him. I also get the feeling that Slughorn is more likely to be of actual use to you, once you get out into the adult world. He very much exemplifies, to me, what House Slytherin is all about... power and influence. You think Malfoy the Elder wouldn't like some of the influence he has?

But Slughorn works at it, whereas Dumbledore gets his sycophanty via authorial fiat.

(NOTE: Damn, I wish we could edit comments, because I keep making MORONIC typos. Please forgive me. I plead the fact that I'm wearing contacts instead of glasses today, although why that should make me use the singular posessive instead of the plural a few posts up I can't say. *cries*)

I also get the feeling that Slughorn is more likely to be of actual use to you, once you get out into the adult world. He very much exemplifies, to me, what House Slytherin is all about... power and influence.

Mmmm...yes, definitely. Mutual back-scratching. which suggests that at some point the kids Slughorn picks get wise to his game, and CHOOSE to play – or not. I don't think Harry has that sort of...flexibility in his dealings with Dumbles.

You think Malfoy the Elder wouldn't like some of the influence he has?

Heh! Although Azkaban's probably the safest place for Lucius these days...

I don't think Harry has that sort of...flexibility

I think that, like a lot of "moral" people, Harry has a hard time doing that kind of back scratching. As we saw in GoF, although he was quick to give Cedric info about the dragon (it's the right thing to do!!!) he was loathe to listen to Cedric's advice, and refused to listen to anything Bagman would say (that's just wrong! and weak).

I think most of the smart kids pick up on Slughorns game very VERY quickly, and the less smart ones never figure out how to play. I mean, it's fairly obvious, although Draco seemed to have some trouble figuring out how little he had to offer. And Slughorn seems pretty egalitarian, considering... I mean, some of his pawns are recruited because of their notable families and riches, and others because they are powerful themselves (Hermione and Ginny).

I think Harry's comfortable with 'back-scratching', personally, as long as he can classify it in his mind as something other than that. I mean, he tends to assume he deserves any/all of the many privileges he recieves, rather than being grateful/resenting the corrupt system he recieves much of it by (of course, the alternative is that Rowling doesn't see it as corrupt/comparable when Harry benefits from favouritism, since he's her Hero and all.)

Hm, that's a good point.

If he gets something because he deserves it, that's one thing... if he gets something because somebody else is being kind and doing him a favor (and he'd be in their debt) that's another.

Harry would never 'get wise' is the problem. He's so outclassed by Dumbley, there'd always be a way to manipulate him back. I've never thought of him as wildly loyal, but I'm reconsidering - he's kind of a Hufflepuff-esque canon fodder/shield really. Once you've won him over, you're set for life, and you have to do very little back, apart from favour/flatter him.

But Slughorn works at it, whereas Dumbledore gets his sycophancy via authorial fiat.

Excellent point!

He very much exemplifies, to me, what House Slytherin is all about... power and influence.

Yeah, Slytherin's one of the most mixed houses in terms of presentation, though, especially considering that two of the most powerful characters we know: Harry and Dumbledore, are of course Gryffindors.

If I wasn't so lazy, I'd totally be in Slytherin.

Because, you know, I like power and influence and making other people do my work for me.

But I'm really lazy. I don't think I could keep up appearance properly, either.

Slytherin is painted as being OMG THE BIG BAD, which is kind of better than Hufflepuff and Ravenclaw, which are barely mentioned at all. Although I think we see more non-Slytherin than Slytherin students. Most of the House S students we see are Draco, Crabbe, Goyle, and Pansy (kind of). They're the only ones that stick out, anyway. But Hufflepuff and Ravenclaw kids keep popping up. So we have all this bad publicity about Slytherin, but see very few Slytherin students... and are told very little non-Sorting Hat info about Ravenclaw and Hufflepuff, but they have fleshed out non-antagonist Ravenclaw and Hufflepuff characters.

Yeah, me too. I'm cunning and all that, just have very little ambition. Maybe I could be a Slytherclaw and spend all day 'researching' on the net or something...

Slytherclaws, UNITE!

Word is bond, man.

Hey, could you get me some cheetos while you're up? Ooh, hey, SomethingAwful updated again...

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HBP: Chapter 4: Welcome to the Harry & Dumbledore Show!

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