OotP Chapter Ten

[sistermagpie.livejournal.com]

Sorry I forgot to post this yesterday!

*I hope we're not supposed to assume Voldemort is making Harry be jealous of Ron and Hermione in his dream. I'd also hope Mrs. Weasley crying over Kreacher was some hint that everyone has family, but it may just be there to create a jumble of images.

*ETA: Yup, turns out anything that looks like Harry being a natural jerk really was Voldemort as per recent interviews which just keep coming.

*In the continuing study of pain management in the Potterverse, the twins knocking Ginny down a flight of stairs with a flying trunk gets them yelled at because they could have caused her Serious Injury. Harry even asks how Ginny is, although of course she's not as hurt as a real girl would have been if knocked down the stairs. This should almost be a Jabootu category, whatever the opposite of the "Hero's battle death" category is. Heroes are more physically vulnerable than bad guys.

*Molly is described as looking like Petunia watching Sirius gambol about, but her advice would have actually protected him. Is there a parallel between Molly/Petunia and Sirius/Harry? Hmmm. Neither women like the person they're protecting, but Molly was right. Sirius makes sure everybody sees him at the station, doing everything but standing up on his hind legs and reciting the Gettysburg address over a megaphone.

*Poor Ron has to make it clear he's not like Percy. This whole thing has been so ruined for him, partly unintentionally, by Harry. He spends so much time feeling unworthy and hiding his pride he can't enjoy it. Hermione, of course, has no such problems. She deserves it and she is proud of it.

*Ginny introduces Luna as "Loony." She then gets into being the Great!Girl by sharply telling Neville he's not "nobody" compared to Harry--which is kind of interesting since we later find out actually, he's right. By a whim of fate he luckily got to be "nobody" instead of Harry.

*ETA: Btw, Harry and Ginny will totally be bffs with Neville and Luna as adults even though it's hard to imagine them ever going out of their way to have contact with them any more than they do in school.

*Harry says Neville must have skipped Luna's compartment because she looked dotty, but I doubt that's true. I think Neville just didn't want to disturb a solitary girl he didn't know in a compartment.

*Neville's family is usually described negatively, but in the all-important present competition they are winning hands down. They always give thoughtful, personal presents Neville really needs and likes. This plant just has to be significant, I think. Either Sirius was somehow affected by it or maybe Neville himself was/will be?

*ETA:Err...nope. Didn't go anyplace.

*Neville tells us he LOST the Rememberall that was the cause of so much fuss first year. Neville is careless with presents people went to a lot of trouble to get for him and Harry's big heroics were pointless in the long run. It was Harry's fight on his own behalf, not Neville's. In fact, it's kind of funny that at 15 that's still the main memory Harry has of Neville so it's all he can come up with to guess at Neville's present.

*ETA: Ultimately I'm not sure where JKR was always going with Harry's obviously not having the time of day for Neville. In the end he never had to feel like he underestimated him and it was like he was a great friend all along.

*Harry is more upset over being seen with Luna and Neville than even being covered in Stinksap because he would rather be with Cool People and he knows these kids aren't it. Please shut up all the people who think Harry's is either a) a big nerd/outcast or b) doesn't notice these things or c) prefers outcasts. He hates to see them bullied. He still thinks they're nerds. I think he takes after his father this way. (James had something against Snape; I don't think he picked on him because he thought he was a weak nerd.)

*Luna comes across as really affected to me.

*The Quibbler once again shows us that in the WW truth and lies are so mixed up the only way you know the difference is if you are the one doing the mixing up.

*Luna loses her dreamy voice when she tells Hermione off, which makes it seem more affected to me.

* Hermione "viciously" calls Pansy "that complete cow" who is "thicker than a concussed troll." (Second negative description--she criticized the Quibbler "scathingly" and made Luna, who's generally friendly, angry.) Apparently Hermione's Pansy-hate is very personal and passionate-suddenly?

*Ron follows suit with his plans to make Goyle write lines, like he hates/knows him personally-I'm not sure why. Did Goyle struggle too much when Ron knocked him out and stole his clothes? Not grunt loudly enough when Ron threw a firecracker in his caldron?

*Hermione claims Ron wanting to do that is "stooping" to Draco's level, though really Ron and Draco both live at this same level regularly, along with most of the school.

*Draco arrives and the scene comes to life.:-D He repeats the same idea Ron just said, reminding Harry he can give punishments, but he does not actually give Harry any punishment, even after Harry calls him a git and everyone laughs on cue, which is nothing like Malfoy making jokes that his friends laugh at loudly. Hermione is furious, I think because she's angry Dumbledore gave Draco a prefect badge like hers, thus sullying it.

*When they get off the train, Hermione comes up "panting" to tell us Malfoy's already using his badge to "bully people worse than ever" because he was "beastly" to first years. (Harry has just noticed that Draco and his friends just pushed by some "timid-looking" second years, timid for more villainy on the Slytherins' part-I wonder if Hermione just had a confrontation with them and they're angry about it.) Now, I've no doubt Malfoy would be generally obnoxious as a prefect as he is everywhere, but I can't see Hermione as objective, especially since she later scolds Ron for calling first years "midgets" and eventually seems to crush any confidence Ron has for asserting authority. To me it honestly seems like just as Malfoy encorporates his prefect badge into the bad parts of his personality, so too does Hermione, using hers to boss and nag and judge everyone worse than ever, telling other prefects they're doing it wrong and reporting them.

*The thestrels are cool, though of course Harry would have seen them last year. I like them being reflected in Luna's eyes. She goes back to the dreamy-quality to tell Harry's he's "as sane as she is." Yes, Luna, you are sane. You don't come across as crazy to me at all, so you can drop the "I'm so different" act.



IITS
Why does Neville, a character known for trying to fade into the background and not start trouble, do something so blatantly stupid as poking that plant to show everyone how it protects itself? He knew it sprayed sap even if he didn't know how much. Why would he think anybody would want to see that? Why would he want to release dung-smelling stuff into the air? Oh yeah--so that Cho could walk in and Harry could be covered in shit. IITS.

Also, the Slytherins seem quite jaunty and friendly for people last seen unconcious at the hands of just these people. IITS.

Nut o’ Fun
That plant--I wasn't sure whether it was a Nut or a Maguffin, actually, because it seems SO IMPORTANT but we never learned if it's affected anybody badly.ETA: just a nut. And a badly chosen one too, because it makes it seem like somebody was drugging Sirius.

Final score: 2.5

Comments

[anehan]

*ETA: Yup, turns out anything that looks like Harry being a natural jerk really was Voldemort as per recent interviews which just keep coming.

What? Has she said that in an interview? *begs Magpie to explain interviews to her, because she just gets cranky if she reads them*

After OotP, I theorized that Harry had such bad mood swings in OotP partly because he was feeling Voldemort's emotions and wasn't able to separate them from his own. Of course, DH convinced me that even if the capslocking was partly because of Voldie, the jerkiness was all Harry's own.

*Ginny introduces Luna as "Loony."

She's such a good friend.

[papier.livejournal.com]

Ginny introduces Luna as "Loony."

Thereby establishing the cruel nickname that she would later attack another boy for using (probably a boy she planned on going out with after Dean, had Harry not intervined).

*ETA: Btw, Harry and Ginny will totally be bffs with Neville and Luna as adults even though it's hard to imagine them ever going out of their way to have contact with them any more than they do in school.

Well apparently they called their daughter Lily Luna Potter. Lily Luna. Lol.

Luna comes across as really affected to me.

Methinks it was a way of bonding with the father after her mother died, by adopting his expressions and therefore wrapping themselves up in their own little world. There's definitely a difference in her at the beginning of HBP, after a year of interacting with people other than her dad for the first time since she started school.
Her belief in strange creatures seems genuine enough, but I doubt she grew up with the oddball nature.

[kaskait.livejournal.com]

Yup, turns out anything that looks like Harry being a natural jerk really was Voldemort as per recent interviews which just keep coming.

Obviously and she did nothing with it. Which shows she didn't know a good story thread when it bit her in the ass.

Instead we got SUPER!Ginny.

OotP 10

[lilian-cho.livejournal.com]

Hermione is furious, I think because she's angry Dumbledore gave Draco a prefect badge like hers, thus sullying it.

Boo, Hermione. Boo.

just as Malfoy encorporates his prefect badge into the bad parts of his personality, so too does Hermione, using hers to boss and nag and judge everyone worse than ever, telling other prefects they're doing it wrong and reporting them.

*nods in perfect agreement*

Yes, Luna, you are sane. You don't come across as crazy to me at all, so you can drop the "I'm so different" act.

AHAHAHAH Gosh I'm actually tempted to re-read this gawdawful book for the Luna parts now.

Oh yeah--so that Cho could walk in and Harry could be covered in shit.

X-D

[savagedamsel10.livejournal.com]

Yay, you posted! I thought you took a break because of the holidays.

*ETA: Yup, turns out anything that looks like Harry being a natural jerk really was Voldemort as per recent interviews which just keep coming.
And the fact that the Hat considered Slytherin. What is up with the insistence on making Harry become even more of a Stu than he already is?!

Harry even asks how Ginny is
Hey, we gotta throw a tiny bone for the case of H/G's super special love every now and then! (This was used as shipping evidence).

*Molly is described as looking like Petunia
But remember, Molly is GOOD. Like how Harry is reminded of Ginny when looking at Bellatrix but Ginny is GOOD.

*Poor Ron has to make it clear he's not like Percy. This whole thing has been so ruined for him, partly unintentionally, by Harry. He spends so much time feeling unworthy and hiding his pride he can't enjoy it. Hermione, of course, has no such problems. She deserves it and she is proud of it.
It's rather annoying since in real life most kids and other prefects will probably get along with him better than Hermione. He's just more generally genial while Hermione's prefecting the prefects would drive other prefects and students up the wall.

I'm sorry, but the whole Harry/Ginny friendship with Neville and Luna is just so damn fake and patronising. I think the reason why Luna seems so affected is because JKR herself does not really get the whole "school kook" mindset.

[(Anonymous)]

*I hope we're not supposed to assume Voldemort is making Harry be jealous of Ron and Hermione in his dream.

Does anyone, including the author, have any idea how the Harrcrux connection works? All Horcruxes can think for themselves and manipulate others, except apparently the one in Harry's head. Did Harry luck out and get Voldemort's toddler stage? Is that why the thing can affect his emotions but hasn't tried to communicate with him or possess him like the diary did Ginny? (Don't tell me, let me guess. Lily's Love!Voodoo protects him to the exact point that the plot requires.)

Conversely, if Harry can access its language module, why can't he use any of Voldemort's other abilities? Or maybe he can. It'd be hilarious if it turned out that Harry's Quidditch and Patronus-producing skills were actually Voldemort's.

He hates to see them bullied. He still thinks they're nerds. I think he takes after his father this way. (James had something against Snape; I don't think he picked on him because he thought he was a weak nerd.)

Well, insofar as we know anything about the whole baffling mess of the Snape-MWPP feud, it's that James was jealous of Snape's friendship with Lily. That said, James comes across to me as a Grade A, natural born bully who'd have hexed people for fun all over the place if Snape had never existed. But then I also get the impression that JKR is more forgiving of bullying than the average reader, and doesn't think she's painted James as irredeemably awful. After all he was physically brave and prejudiced in the right direction (Slytherin), so that's his essential goodness settled, there.

-L

[(Anonymous)]

"Harry even asks how Ginny is, although of course she's not as hurt as a real girl would have been if knocked down the stairs."

And of course, because it is Ginny it isn't as hilarious as it would have been if it was Dudley or some random Slytherin. But I forgot, magical folks are resilient and can't be killed by a mere fall down the stairs and in case of a Weasley the attendant battering is bound to only make them tougher and sassier. I wonder how anybody can see Molly as such a terrible tyrant towards the twins - no matter what they do she only ever yells at them. I mean, after they almost killed Dudley with that toffee they still weren't made to miss the Quidditch Cup or anything. Is it a wonder then that their antics kept escalating?

Molly and Sirius - yes, she certainly got hers from him the whole time she was at Grimmauld's. How dare she urge Sirius to make himself useful or not to endanger everybody involved? I mean, if he was caught in the company of other Order members and kids they would have been only sent to jail/ lost their jobs / been expelled from Hogwarts. What a flimsy pretext to ruin his fun!

Yes, trio's relationship with Luna and Neville is vomit-inducing. More so with Neville, though, who pathetically craved their friendship for the larger part of the series and whom they firmly kept at a distance, patronizingly protecting him at times. OTOH, only against Slytherins. When the twins chose to turn him into a canary, he had to grin and bear it. Luna stood for herself a bit more. But in the end, both had to actively and aggressively inflict their friendship and support onto the trio... and still during the books themselves they never became more than acquaintances. HBP had been brutally clear on this point.

Pansy did have her time in the sun in GOF, giving interviews and indulging in anti-trio propaganda, so it makes some sense for Hermione to be annoyed with her. But apparently there is a larger and creepier aspect to it - in one of the interviews Rowling said how Pansy was a personification of all girls who had been mean to her in school and thus didn't even deserve to marry Draco. So, yes, her quest for vengeance continues.

Re: Ron's prefectship - I really hate Ron's portrayal in the books and I would have liked him to be more than a second fiddle. I so hoped that he'd find something that would allow him to get out of shadow of Harry and Hermione, some area at which he would be unquestionably the best. But the iron fist of JKR condemned him to be an eternal follower and minion, who is not allowed to best Harry at anything and Hermione only at humor, sports and very occasional flashes of intuition.

But as described, Ron was a truly awful prefect, sorry. His inability to stand up to people he liked (except for Hermione) has been well established even in the earlier books, as well as his laziness and profound disinterest in anybody outside the circle of friends and family. Due to the twins he was also inured to bullying and practiced it, although in mild and subconscious form, on kids under his authority.
Particularly in an environment such as Hogwarts, where teachers take very little interest in what happens in dormitories and common rooms, Ron would have been a complete disaster. Of course, as always Rowling uses a cop-out to avoid showing realistic consequences of his nonchalance, just as she chose to completely overlook positive consequences of Percy's adherence to his duty. Clearly, folks like McLaggen would never dream of bullying anybody except for Our Heroes and only when plot requires it. And everybody in Gryffindor just adores whatever the twins chose to dish out - be that pus-filled boils, vomit inducing pastilles, suffocating tongue-toffees (that could easily kill a young kid affected, if there were no other witnesses) or whatever. Etc.

[jodel-from-aol.livejournal.com]

>I totally suport Harry losing his abilities. And relying in his Auror's job on his saviour's reputation and help of Ron, Hermione and Neville :).<

Yes that's right ladies and germs! She has not only welshed and returned to her version of the future where Ron has joined Harry in the Ministry, she has now decided to try to tell us that Neville signed up as well.

The silly bint can't even keep track of what her characters were doing between the battle and the epilogue.

She *cares* so much about them , you know...

[horridporrid.livejournal.com]

Apparently Hermione's Pansy-hate is very personal and passionate-suddenly?
*Ron follows suit with his plans to make Goyle write lines, like he hates/knows him personally-I'm not sure why.

The Slytherins really seem like the oddest school-villains ever. They don't ever beat our heroes at anything. They've got nothing to lord over our heroes with (ie more popular, more authority, better grades, etc). And yet we're supposed to see them as the source of our heroes misery.

...so too does Hermione, using hers to boss and nag and judge everyone worse than ever, telling other prefects they're doing it wrong and reporting them.

Can you imagine rooming with her? It must have been a nightmare. Frankly, it surprises me that Hermione has any friends at all.

[artystone.livejournal.com]

OMFG. I want all the time back I wasted reading these books.

>:(

[montavilla.livejournal.com]

JKR: Damn right, she does, and I think that's a pretty cool career, and I think that makes Neville quite cool that he married her, don't you think

What is this obsession with cool with JKR? At another point, she praised Harry for becoming cool after arriving at Hogwarts as a "scrawny, specky git."

Cripes, Harry and Neville saved the world. But Neville still needs a coolness boost?

[cressida0201.livejournal.com]

This plant just has to be significant, I think. Either Sirius was somehow affected by it or maybe Neville himself was/will be?

Huh. Can't say I was ever misled by that one, but now that you mention it, wouldn't that have been a cool plotline? I suppose it could be foreshadowing that one plant later, that's used to kill the guy in St. Mungo's.

*ETA: Ultimately I'm not sure where JKR was always going with Harry's obviously not having the time of day for Neville. In the end he never had to feel like he underestimated him and it was like he was a great friend all along.

Harry was treating Neville with all the respect he deserved, of course. Neville could never have handled being The Boy Who Lived--JKR said so! No matter how many people helped him, no matter how determined he was, no matter what experiences he had, he would have failed. Harry was demonstrating great kindness by even giving him the time of day. And look how that helped Neville to blossom--in a second-rate way, of course, because he's inferior!

Please shut up all the people who think Harry's is either a) a big nerd/outcast or b) doesn't notice these things or c) prefers outcasts. He hates to see them bullied.

Would you believe I actually have a friend who gushes about how wonderful it is that Harry was able to make something of the terrible life he led?

I don't think he [James] picked on him [Snape] because he thought he was a weak nerd.

I actually do believe that the James-Snape animosity was mutual, and I don't assume that James started it, either. We've seen enough of Snape in action to know that he's more than capable of provoking these things. So I don't like using the phrase "picked on" to describe their entire relationship, because I'm sure there were many other incidents we didn't see where Snape did not come off nearly so innocent. However, I simply can't buy the "rivalry over Lily" explanation. The earlier version, that they took a dislike to each other on sight as children, rings much more true.

*The Quibbler once again shows us that in the WW truth and lies are so mixed up the only way you know the difference is if you are the one doing the mixing up.

Which, again, could actually have led to some interesting storylines.

To me it honestly seems like just as Malfoy encorporates his prefect badge into the bad parts of his personality, so too does Hermione, using hers to boss and nag and judge everyone worse than ever, telling other prefects they're doing it wrong and reporting them.

I agree with the person who said Ron is also a terrible prefect, however. And I can't imagine Harry wouldn't have been any better. A while back, someone wondered why the boys' prefect for their year wasn't Dean. He really does seem like the best candidate to me.

*The thestrels are cool, though of course Harry would have seen them last year.

Why would he have seen them then?