GOF Chapter 5: Weasleys' Wizard Wheezes

[oryx_leucoryx]

Fred is excited at the thought of Dudley eating deadly candy. Oh, *untested* deadly candy, that's even better!
Harry takes an instinctive liking to Charlie because everything in his appearance says 'physical, uncomplicated'. Bill is more of a surprise - you can be a Head Boy *and* 'cool'. (Just like your dad, Harry. Now you don't have to worry he was anything like Percy, in case you ever were.) How does Harry know what people who attend rock concerts look like? Probably from TV.

Yes Arthur, pranking Muggles in life-endangering ways without doing the responsible thing and mind-wiping them in the aftermath undermines wizard-Muggles relations. Unlike, say, taking their magical kids and turning them against their parents.

The Dursleys excuse away Dudley's misdeeds. Arthur is a much superior parent - he doesn't let his wife know about the twins' (or at least tries to avoid letting her know). It does seem as though Hermione caught on quickly and tried to do her bit of protecting the twins from Molly.

This is Hermione's first stay at the Burrow - and she is here even before Harry, who has been here before and who might need 'rescuing' from his home. I wonder how long Hermione was there before Harry's arrival. Nevertheless, this was the last summer she will spend any significant time with her parents. And she will only spend Christmas of 6th year with them because of the Ron/Lavender relationship. To remind you, Hermione will turn 15 next month - an emancipated minor for all intent  and purpose.

For the first time in canon, Ginny isn't at all awkward around Harry. Despite not having started dating any other boys yet. (Or has she and we weren't told? We don't know when she and Hermione had their little talk.)

I'm supposed to think Percy is a pompous, ambitious idiot for taking work home and caring about it. Being an adult I see Percy as acting normally and Ron being an immature idiot. BTW after seeing Neville's molten cauldrons can't Ron appreciate looking into safety standards? (No, because danger everywhere is what makes life worth living for most Gryffindors.)

Why are Bill and Charlie staying in the twins' room? In later books (HBP and DH) Bill will suddenly have his own room, which he will also share with Charlie. See www.hplex.info/wizworld/places/w_pl_burrow.html. Did Molly and Arthur decide to add rooms (on the lower floors!) after their sons started leaving home?

Ron is annoyed by his owl. This is typical of Ron - he laments not having things, and when he does he laments them again, even when they aren't obviously unsuitable or in bad shape or taste.

Ron makes a homophobic wisecrack at Percy and his boss. BTW according to the Black Family Tree, it appears Bartemius Crouch Sr is Arthur's first cousin. This together with his outward personality and his position all make him an ideal surrogate father to Percy. (Which starts the theme of disappointed sons in this book.)

Ginny is still an outsider to the trio's adventures - as far as Harry knows. Neither of them had openly shared their involvement with Sirius' escape. (BTW Harry still hasn't questioned if perhaps Albus was a tad responsible for there not being more people aware of what Sirius was or wasn't guilty of.)

Crookshanks was one of the heroes of last year's adventure - sniffing Peter out in his rat disguise, communicating with Sirius, sending messages by post. This year he's just a cat who chases gnomes.

Molly rants about the twins. She blames them of lacking ambition. No Molly, they are more ambitious than anyone in the family. It's just that their ambition is to make a lot of money fast, while causing as much property destruction and humiliation to those around their customers as possible, instead of doing well at school and getting a government job. Oh, Molly did receive the occasional owl from the school about the twins. Though I do wonder if Albus or Minerva framed their actions as bullying the way Dudley's teachers apparently described his stunts. Also, Molly mistakes a twin-made fake wand for her own, thus starting the emphasis on wands in this book. (There will also be emphasis on wands in DH, but everything will work completely differently, despite Rowling's claims about planning and plotting. You have been warned.)

There was a time I found Bill and Charlie's table-duel endearing. By now I have had enough of Gryffindor boisterous behavior.

Even Bill joins those who dis Percy. Because while he works for a bank, his job description is robbing graves, which is much better than working in an office regulating international commercial transactions.

I love Percy's earnestness and enthusiastic attitude. His criticism of Bagman is on relevant points - organizing the Quidditch World Cup sounds like something that should have fallen mostly on a department dedicated to Magical Games and Sports (an entire department for that? not a subdivision of a Department for Cultural Affairs or similar? Tells you everything about wizards and their priorities), and an employee going missing for 'over a month' in a place known to be the location of Voldemort in whatever form he was isn't something to ignore. But to Arthur what matters is that by covering up illegal activities of Ludo's brother he got tickets to the Top Box, so he won't be hearing criticism of his friend. Who had bribed him. However having grown up in the Weasley household I think this goes over even Percy's head. Understandably but tragically Percy interprets Bartemius' concern for Bertha's whereabouts as that of a caring boss for a former underling. Of course he is actually concerned because she had subconscious information that might be of use to Voldemort (as well as cause much trouble to Crouch himself if revealed to the public). It has been several years since Bertha became brain damaged. Since Harry forgot all about his dream the mention of her name rings no bells.

Ginny defends Bill's hairstyle to Molly. Showing us that despite lack of awkwardness around Harry this is still her first personality, whose favorite brother was Bill. Next year we'll see Ginny v 2.0 whose role models are the twins.

The Quidditch chatter reveals that like in football (soccer for USians), Britain has separate 'national' teams for England, Scotland and Wales. But all three lost at some point.

Harry confirms - the letter about his scar hurting was the first he sent to Sirius, after receiving 2 from him in addition to the letter he got at the end of POA. Sirius 3, Harry 1. Even with people who are close to him he is more of a taker than a giver.

The twins sent Percy dragon dung in the mail, how hilarious! How kind, how mature.

Comments

[jodel-from-aol.livejournal.com]

Yes indeed. A muggle will see only a ruin where a wizard will see a castle. But a camera is neither. It ought to show what is actually there. Unless you try to argue that the spells are so powerful that a muggle will see only a photograph of a ruin. And, excuse me, but I don't believe that.

Now I have seen arguments that spells interfere with electronic transmissions (for that matter, I theorized that they interfere because both use the same frequencies and consequently they are fighting for the same bandwidth) and that consequently areas rendered unplotable would be unphotographable as well, at least by digital cameras, resulting in known anomolies in the muggle reference materials i.e. the "Wiltshire blob" or the "Scots blur", or whatever. But how did that work back when survey cameras were film cameras? Because there have *been* aerial photo surveys since the first half of the 20th century.

[oryx_leucoryx]

And we know Colin's Muggle camera worked at Hogwarts.

Camera

[urbanman1984.livejournal.com]

I bet JKR has already forgotten that she included that detail in the texts. She never rereads anything, remember?

[majorjune.livejournal.com]

Now I have seen arguments that spells interfere with electronic transmissions (for that matter, I theorized that they interfere because both use the same frequencies and consequently they are fighting for the same bandwidth)

The problem with that theory is that magikal spells would have to be using all bands, includia radio (short, long, and medium waves)/radar, sonar, microwave, infrared, ultraviolet...

I just don't buy it. Of course we're dealing with Jo I-Can't-Be-Bothered-With-Real-Science Rowling here, but even if for the sake of argument we postulate that magikal spells do utilize all bandwidths, then when Muggle society started using more and more of those same bandwidths, there should have been competition for the limited "airwaves"...

IOW, it should be a two-way street. If spells can interfere with electronic transmissions, then electronic transmissions should also be able to interfere with spells.

It may not be so much of a problem at Hogwarts, being in a remote, rural area...but it seems to me that the Ministry building should be effected by all the electronic transmissons in and around London.

Because there have *been* aerial photo surveys since the first half of the 20th century.

Well I guess Rowling would argue that it would work the same way with pilots, that they would only see ruins and not take pictures. Of course that ignores pilots who were just taking aerial surveys for topographical/mapping purposes, and so would have just flown a grid pattern over a certain area.

Rowling would probably then argue that the cloaking spell worked for a certain distance over Hogwarts in addition to surrounding it on the ground. But then the question is, just how far up does this cloaking go? A couple of hundred feet? A couple of thousand? To the edge of the earth's atmosphere?

Surely she can't expect us to believe the spell works for thousands of miles into outer space? (But being Jo I-Can't-Be-Bothered-With-Real-Science Rowling, maybe she does) Maybe a pilot of a plane wouldn't be able to see Hogwarts, maybe a manual camera wouldn't be able to capture its image (perhaps resulting in fogged film), but I can't accept the premise that a spy satellite with a high-def digital camera couldn't take pictures of it.

[jodel-from-aol.livejournal.com]

Well, for that matter, while actually *at Hogwarts* all the ambiant magic would have to do would be to interfere with electronic devices drawing power from their batteries. Away from an area like Hogwarts where there is no installed electrical wiring, no transmitors, and a lot of ambient magic, it would be a lot less cut and dried.

We've never heard that living next to a wizard interferes with one's television reception, or access to the internet. Indeed, about the most Rowling has ever claimed is that electronic devices don't work *at Hogwarts*.

They may be a bit dicy in Diagon Alley as well, although perhaps not. Diagon Alley, unlike Hogwarts, is surrounded by installed transmitters of various kinds and despite having a high level of ambient magic it ought not to be that difficult for a device inside its bounds to find a signal, so the real question is whether the magic levels are high enough to interfere with drawing power from the batteries there. And I suspect that the issue really does come down to battery-operated devices.

After all, it stands to reason that there must be Muggle businesses and residences in use right on the other side of the wall from the perimeter of the wizarding enclave, and if the mere proximity to magic is enough to interfere with actual *wiring* one would expect that someone would have mentioned it. And it would be a concern since sooner or later someone would be bound to go looking for *why* the wiring is so dicy in that part of town.

We have no idea as to what the typical result of a wizarding household moving into a muggle structure with functioning electrical wiring would be. #12 Grimauld Place is almost certainly from the era where the default would have been gaslight, and electricity doesn't sound like anything the Blacks would have bothered to have added on. Spinners End also was probably built at a time when heat was coal and light was kerosine (or parafin, acto the Brits). We simply do not know any wizards who come from a mixed enough background to try to have it both ways. It may be perfectly viable if you aren't trying to run on battery power.

[majorjune.livejournal.com]

Well, for that matter, while actually *at Hogwarts* all the ambiant magic would have to do would be to interfere with electronic devices drawing power from their batteries.

Perhaps, but then Jo has some 'splainin' to do regarding the Weasley's Ford Anglia...not only the internal combustion engine operated on Hogwarts grounds, but it's electrical system, too (indeed the engine would be worthless without the electrical system).

Of course Jo I-Have-Never-Driven-A-Car Rowling wouldn't consider that automobiles have a battery and an electrical system.

Spinners End also was probably built at a time when heat was coal and light was kerosine (or parafin, acto the Brits).

My own admitted prejudice, based on such places here in New England, is that "mill town" residences of the type described would have had electricity, since most of them were built circa 1900-1920. Even older residences were wired for electricity by the 1920s and 30s, and since Snape's father was a Muggle, I don't see why he wouldn't have had a house with electricity, and perhaps a gas stove (cooker).

Rowling doesn't really give us much to go on, but in the HBP movie, the Spinner's End scene shows us a glimpse of a kitchen that looks mid-20th century modern, perhaps dating from between the 50s to the 70s. I think electrical outlets can also be seen in the kitchen.

It was in a Muggle neighborhood, and there was no reason for Eileen to put spells on it to prevent the use of technology, so Spinner's End probably can't be used as a valid example.

We simply do not know any wizards who come from a mixed enough background to try to have it both ways. It may be perfectly viable if you aren't trying to run on battery power.

So what happens when a wizard or witch marries a Muggle? Does the non-magikal person just joyfully give up all the modern technological conveniences that they are accustomed to?

MUGGLE BOY TO WITCH GIRLFRIEND: Yeah, that's kewl that you can just say "Luminos" and your wand tip glows...but look at this new gigantic flatscreen I got! Wii will be AWESOME on it! Look how I can tweet about what I'm doing on my new iPhone! Look at how many friends I have on Facebook! What? You say I'll have to give this up if we get married?.......See ya around, sweetheart!

[jodel-from-aol.livejournal.com]

Well, there are a number of LiveJournalists who grew up in mill towns in Britain, and acto one of the more vocal of them, the houses themselves were typically built in the mid to late 19th century, built as worker housing, owned by the mill, and tenancy was a part of the perks of employment at the mill (and probably meant that the actual wages were lower, since housing was provided. Coal to heat it came out of the monitary wage, of course). It was only after the mills were shut down -- which mostly took place between the 1920s and the 1960s -- that the houses were sold off to the tenants, or to people who bought them as rental properties.

From that point whatever amentities were added to them were at the discression of the owner. Some landlords simply didn't. The person whose Lj described it had lived in one as a child, as late as the 1960s which still had no electricity.

Most, of course were modernized much earlier. They were usually tiny little places by modern standards, but very sturdily built. I understand that in the last 20 years or so gentrification has tended to buy up a pair, or three of them, and remodel them into one good-sized residence.

And yes, if that was Toby Snape's house, there ought to have been at least some degree of modernization laid on (Indoor plumbing for one thing. That usually wasn't original). But we do not know for sure that it was, if it had been the house that Eileen Prince had grown up in there might have been very little. We're given only an impressionistic picture of life at Spinner's End in the '60s and '70s and no real data on what the priorities of its inhabitants at that time were. By the '90s it is Snape's house and his priorities seem to run to a lot of bookcases, but we do not know what the place had looked like 20 years earlier.

Yes, the Ford Anglia ought certainly to have had a battery and an electrical system. But then, wouldn't that have been the part of the thing that became sentient? If that's the case, clearly by this time the wiring is conducting magic.

[majorjune.livejournal.com]

And yes, if that was Toby Snape's house, there ought to have been at least some degree of modernization laid on (Indoor plumbing for one thing. That usually wasn't original). But we do not know for sure that it was, if it had been the house that Eileen Prince had grown up in there might have been very little.

What sort of evidence is there that it was the house Eileen grew up in?

Since she was a pureblood witch, I find it hard to believe that her witch mother and wizard father would have owned or even rented a millworker's residence in a Muggle neighborhood.

Yes, the Ford Anglia ought certainly to have had a battery and an electrical system. But then, wouldn't that have been the part of the thing that became sentient? If that's the case, clearly by this time the wiring is conducting magic.

Pehaps, but I view it as equivalent to the nervous system and circulatory system of a human body; while the nervous system is related to, and controlled by the brain, it very pointedly is not the brain itself. Something has to "tell" the auto's electrical system what to do.

[oryx_leucoryx]

Since she was a pureblood witch

We don't know her blood-status. She could have been the daughter of a pureblood and Muggle-born, pureblood and half-blood, two half-bloods ...

[oryx_leucoryx]

For information from a British POV about what life at Spinner's End might have been like, see Spinner's End: what we know or can surmise about the location of Snape's (and Lily and Tuney's) childhood home by whitehound (though I don't think she mentions the electricity situation).

Magic and electricity

[urbanman1984.livejournal.com]

>>MUGGLE BOY TO WITCH GIRLFRIEND: Yeah, that's kewl that you can just say "Luminos" and your wand tip glows...but look at this new gigantic flatscreen I got! Wii will be AWESOME on it! Look how I can tweet about what I'm doing on my new iPhone! Look at how many friends I have on Facebook! What? You say I'll have to give this up if we get married?.......See ya around, sweetheart!<<

And that would be rejoined with an obliviate...

You are all giving this a lot more thought than JKR ever did, that's for certain.

[karentheunicorn.livejournal.com]

Rowling would probably then argue


I pretty much know what the authors answer would be for magically hiding stuff from old and new technology.

JKR, like an Iphone would just proclaim - We have an APP for that.

Just replace APP with the word spell. =p


Besides, if muggles see ruins doesn't that make them want to take more pictures???? To me that would invite people to want to look, instead of making them less curious about the place.

To me it would have been better to say it was a waste water treatement plant. To me that would have kept curious people away and kept anyone from wanting to investigate. But a old ruined castle? All kinds of people would be interested in looking and photographing that.

I guess the muggles who are adventurest enough get their memories erased if they trespass.

[600ants.livejournal.com]

Well I guess Rowling would argue that it would work the same way with pilots, that they would only see ruins and not take pictures.

Wait, she actually said that Muggles see Hogwarts as a ruin and therefore just don't care about it? The stupid, stupid... woman. Even with authorities such as the land office (who generally like to know about all buildings in their assigned district) put aside, if there is a ruin of a castle anywhere, it's bound to be frequented by local kids, random tourists, amateur archaeologists etc. Besides, Hogwarts is not just the castle – it's a large area with a lake, a stadium, a village and a forrest – how is the Forbidden Forrest prevented from being entered by Muggles? And how is it possible to hide a railway from London to Scotland? And even if Muggles really couldn't see any of this, what prevents them from hearing the noise the wizards produce?

[oryx_leucoryx]

In chapter 11 of GOF, Hermione says Muggles see Hogwarts a s aruin with a sign saying 'danger, keep out'.

[lynn-waterfall.livejournal.com]

Exactly. I mean, who'd ignore a *sign*?

Any Gryffindor would find that sign an added attraction. Well, maybe Muggles are never supposed to be Gryffindor-types.

[600ants.livejournal.com]

LOL, silly me for asking. It's probably just me forgeting stuff again, but what would happen if somebody ignored the sign (as unlikely as that is :)) and walzed past it right in Hogwarts? Would a Muggle just stand on the top of, say, Hagrid's hut, and still not see it? Or would he pass through, as if the building wasn't even there?

[oryx_leucoryx]

Well, the sign may be backed up by more mental magic.

Muggles are either good little obedient Hufflepuffs or evil Slytherins, of course.

[majorjune.livejournal.com]

Besides, Hogwarts is not just the castle – it's a large area with a lake, a stadium, a village and a forrest – how is the Forbidden Forrest prevented from being entered by Muggles? And how is it possible to hide a railway from London to Scotland? And even if Muggles really couldn't see any of this, what prevents them from hearing the noise the wizards produce?

ROWLING: Silly! You expect me to be concerned with science and logic? LOL

[600ants.livejournal.com]

I know, I know. Guess I should stop caring, too. :)

[borg-princess.livejournal.com]

if there is a ruin of a castle anywhere, it's bound to be frequented by local kids, random tourists, amateur archaeologists etc. Besides, Hogwarts is not just the castle – it's a large area with a lake, a stadium, a village and a forrest – how is the Forbidden Forrest prevented from being entered by Muggles? And how is it possible to hide a railway from London to Scotland? And even if Muggles really couldn't see any of this, what prevents them from hearing the noise the wizards produce?

Very good points! I love this, it's something I'd never thought about, and you're so right! The only thing I can suggest are Muggle-Repelling Charms, so they'd make people want to keep away. I have this scene in my head where the local land people see the images and want to go check it out, so off a couple of them go, but then return almost immediately, to the puzzlement of their colleagues. 'Why didn't you go explore? Wasn't that the plan?'/'Yeah...I just lost interest, I guess?' So then the others decide to go take a look...and they also return very quickly, having suddenly become disinterested in exploring. And it happens over and over, with them, with others, and it's just this loop of people being repelled, lol.

ETA. IDK about that railway, though. Would it really have spells all over the entire length of it? What if someone wanders across the invisible railway track just as the train goes past? O.o

[oryx_leucoryx]

If I could write, there's an idea that's going on through my head - the Creeveys attempt to attend a memorial service for those who died in the battle of Hogwarts. But they can only see the place if Dennis is with them, and he has to keep reminding them why they are there so they can overcome the Muggle-repelling charms. When they are not being distracted by the Charms their experience is like a form of sensory deprivation. They are completely dependent on Dennis to interact with the environment.

The above would be a prologue to a story about Muggle relatives of wizards forming a support group (probably online, wizards won't know to look there). They would recruit the Grangers and Mr Finnigan, among others. But I think what they would like eventually is to find Muggle relatives of magical children who are still under Hogwarts age, maybe encourage them to leave the country before their children turn 11. So they may need a contact who knows how Hogwarts works. This could be a very disillusioned Severus Snape, if he managed to escape from the Shrieking Shack to the Muggle world.

Since I can't write I'm just leaving this outline for anyone who might be interested.

[600ants.livejournal.com]

They are completely dependent on Dennis to interact with the environment.

It really does seem stupid, doesn't it? Especially when most of the so-called wizarding families apparently are mixed, and have both magical and Muggle members. It would be much easier if the concealing charms worked on the basis of “once you're told about it or shown it, you can see it.”

probably online, wizards won't know to look there So much win! I like the way you think. :D Can't write worth a darn either, though. :(

Fanfiction

[urbanman1984.livejournal.com]

I would write it if and only if it involved Hermione suffering a really APPALLING fate. Is that OK? Where the story includes a plot line in which Harry meets a different shockingly evil witch who wants to be the power behind his throne instead of Hermione?

[600ants.livejournal.com]

'Why didn't you go explore? Wasn't that the plan?'/'Yeah...I just lost interest, I guess?' So then the others decide to go take a look...and they also return very quickly, having suddenly become disinterested in exploring. And it happens over and over, with them, with others, and it's just this loop of people being repelled, lol. - Exactly! The repelling charms might work for a while, but then people would notice that there is something strange in the area, like it was trying to keep them out or something, and that would only drag more attention – like the Bermuda Triangle, or “haunted“ castles.

ETA. IDK about that railway, though. Would it really have spells all over the entire length of it? What if someone wanders across the invisible railway track just as the train goes past? O.o If they were wizards, they would see it. If Muggles, well tough luck and several more inexplicable deaths for the tabloids to write about. :D In the movies, IIRC, the train is seen going across fields. And I wonder how do the farmers plough over the invisible rails?

Btw. Speaking of the Forbiden Forest – what keeps the magical creatures from leaving it? Why do they live somewhere dark and dangerous, if they could just run wild in the Highlands? Don't tell me they fear the stupid, powerless Muggles?! :)

[seductivedark.livejournal.com]

In the movies, IIRC, the train is seen going across fields. And I wonder how do the farmers plough over the invisible rails?


I'm going to suggest (not that Rowling put any thought this direction at all) that the train track is disguised as an old, unused track that the railroad "won't take down" since it's possible they "may use it again." I've seen older tracks, raised a little from the surrounding area, going through fields. Farmers just cut passageways under the tracks for their cows to go across.

An old, deserted rail line can also breed stories of the Ghost Train that comes along four times every year...