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deathtocapslock* First of all, sorry this is so late, I'm afraid I've been a bit busy preparing to go back to university.
* This is the chapter in which Hermione officially crosses the line from “occasionally strident and self-righteous but on the whole likeable and sympathetic character” to “dangerous sociopath”.
* “‘A gorgeous centaur...’ sighed Parvati.” I must say that, given the, erm, associations of centaurs in classical mythology, this sort of thing rather creeps me out. Is JKR aware of the implications of what she’s writing? Or did she just throw it in without bothering to think it through?
* Hermione’s dropping dark hints about what Umbridge is going to do, revealing the plot like any good author avatar would.
* So Harry can remember the names of centaurs he met once four years ago, but in DH he won’t be able to remember a face from a picture from one chapter to the next. *coughplotconveniencecough*
* Wow, centaurs sure are arrogant and condescending people. No wonder Dumbledore felt enough of an affinity with Firenze to hire him as a teacher. He recognises a kindred spirit when he sees one.
* If I were JKR, I’d be hesitant to dignify the wizarding conflicts with the term “war”. They’re more like gang wars than what most people would think of as warfare. Which is why epic fantasy doesn’t really mix with a “secret magical people in this world” plot. Epic fantasy generally centres around mighty empires, big wars and bloody battles, but these things are generally quite noticeable, and any wizards fighting in large-scale conflicts would be found out pretty quickly. So the wizarding war pretty much has to be low-key to make it plausible that Muggles wouldn’t know about it, and the end result is that we get a lot of build-up and very little payoff.
* Firenze spends the whole lesson teaching them something which he doesn’t expect them to do anyway, and which is anyway a bit uncertain and useless. So he’s about as good as the average Hogwarts teacher, then.
* “Indeed, Harry sometimes wondered how Umbridge was going to react when all the members of the DA received ‘Outstanding’ in their Defence Against the Dark Arts OWLs.” Only kidding, Harry will be the only one to get an “Outstanding” mark, because he’sa Mary Sue just the most awesome DADA student ever.
* Although everybody always goes on about how smart Hermione is, and from what we see of her she doesn’t seem noticeably worse in DADA than she does in other subjects, so if she only got an “E” in her Defence OWL, that’s probably because Harry’s not a very good teacher... :p
* Seamus’ Patronus “was definitely something hairy”. *mind goes into the gutter*
* Hermione’s Patronus is an otter, even though she’s one of the least otter-like people in the series. On a Doylist level, this is probably because JKR’s favourite animal is the otter, so her author avatar will have one as her Patronus, obviously. On a Watsonian level, perhaps Patronuses don’t represent what your personality is like, but what you need to guard you and keep you out of trouble. So Hermione’s is an otter because she needs fun-loving people around her to stop her getting too serious about everything, Ron’s is a weasel because he needs smart people to compensate for his mental inadequacy, and Harry’s is a stag because he needs a proper father-figure to help him, not an abusive one like Uncle Vernon or a scheming and manipulative one like Dumbledore. Patronuses which change when somebody falls in love show that their caster needs to be loved by their intended in order to feel happy and secure again.
* Dobby appears, wearing “his usual eight woollen hats”. I quite like the suggestion that it was this sight that made Hermione drop her SPEW activities, as she saw that her hats were all going to this one elf, and that they were therefore pretty useless from a freeing people standpoint. (Can anybody remember if SPEW is brought up again in this book?)
* Umbridge is here! I bet it’s times like this that the DA wish they had a second, secret entrance from the ROR. That way they could slip away while Umbridge and her cronies sat uselessly in front of the main entrance.
* Draco’s concealed “beneath an ugly dragon-shaped vase”, to match his ugly and monstrous soul.
* Umbridge has “an indecent excitement in her voice”. I wonder if this is how Hermione would sound to those on the receiving end of her little schemes.
* When I first read this scene, I didn’t really mind the “Sneak” curse, because I just sort of assumed that Madam Pomfrey managed to find a way of removing them after a couple of weeks. Then we found out that she still had the scars years later and... yikes.
* Not only is that extremely vindictive, but it doesn’t actually help the DA in any way. It didn’t stop them being betrayed in the first place, and it didn’t alert them to the fact that Umbridge was coming to get them. If this had been a one-off incident and the curse hadn’t been permanent, I’d be inclined to put it down to youthful lack of thought, but when you compare it to some of Hermione’s other actions (her treatment of Rita Skeeter, or sending those canaries after Ron), it seems like a rather worrying pattern is starting to emerge...
* Minerva gets all self-righteous about Willy Widdershins being let off. I wonder whether she feels the same about Mundungus Fletcher, or whether petty crooks are OK just as long as they’re on her side.
* Also, she’s not above a bit of petty corruption herself, since she lets Gryffindor Quidditch players off homework when a match is coming up.
* So Kingsley memory-wipes Marietta to stop her telling. You know, this is exactly the sort of mentality that leads DEs to Imperius people and get them to do their bidding: not caring about your victims’ autonomy, just violating their minds when it’s convenient to do so.
* Also, if they are going to mind-wipe Marietta, why not do it to Percy, Fudge and Umbridge too? That would get them out of trouble entirely.
* And really guys, Umbridge has a list of DA members and access to Veritaserum. Obliviating one witness shouldn’t be enough.
* I’m surprised Umbridge thought she could get away with manhandling students like that in front of Dumbledore. I mean, that man’s just so concerned about his students’ welfare.
* Hermione left the membership list pinned to the ROR wall. Well done, Hermione. Not that any DA members will point out this idiocy to her. Nor will they point out the fact that her defensive jinx was (a) vindictive and useless, and (b) not told about to them when they joined up. Maybe they’re all worried she’ll brand the word “COMPLAINER” across their forehead if they speak up.
* Dumbledore taking the rap is all very noble and everything, but I don’t see how it’s meant to help. Fudge can still charge the pupils with attending, even if they didn’t organise it, and now Dumbledore’s ensured that he’s going to be on the run and unable to give them any help.
* Face-scarring aside, I actually quite liked this chapter. It was quite well-paced, and I never really felt like I was wading through pages of filler. It will be interesting to see if the other chapters will be more like this now the book’s reaching its climax, or whether the quality will slip back down again.
* This is the chapter in which Hermione officially crosses the line from “occasionally strident and self-righteous but on the whole likeable and sympathetic character” to “dangerous sociopath”.
* “‘A gorgeous centaur...’ sighed Parvati.” I must say that, given the, erm, associations of centaurs in classical mythology, this sort of thing rather creeps me out. Is JKR aware of the implications of what she’s writing? Or did she just throw it in without bothering to think it through?
* Hermione’s dropping dark hints about what Umbridge is going to do, revealing the plot like any good author avatar would.
* So Harry can remember the names of centaurs he met once four years ago, but in DH he won’t be able to remember a face from a picture from one chapter to the next. *coughplotconveniencecough*
* Wow, centaurs sure are arrogant and condescending people. No wonder Dumbledore felt enough of an affinity with Firenze to hire him as a teacher. He recognises a kindred spirit when he sees one.
* If I were JKR, I’d be hesitant to dignify the wizarding conflicts with the term “war”. They’re more like gang wars than what most people would think of as warfare. Which is why epic fantasy doesn’t really mix with a “secret magical people in this world” plot. Epic fantasy generally centres around mighty empires, big wars and bloody battles, but these things are generally quite noticeable, and any wizards fighting in large-scale conflicts would be found out pretty quickly. So the wizarding war pretty much has to be low-key to make it plausible that Muggles wouldn’t know about it, and the end result is that we get a lot of build-up and very little payoff.
* Firenze spends the whole lesson teaching them something which he doesn’t expect them to do anyway, and which is anyway a bit uncertain and useless. So he’s about as good as the average Hogwarts teacher, then.
* “Indeed, Harry sometimes wondered how Umbridge was going to react when all the members of the DA received ‘Outstanding’ in their Defence Against the Dark Arts OWLs.” Only kidding, Harry will be the only one to get an “Outstanding” mark, because he’s
* Although everybody always goes on about how smart Hermione is, and from what we see of her she doesn’t seem noticeably worse in DADA than she does in other subjects, so if she only got an “E” in her Defence OWL, that’s probably because Harry’s not a very good teacher... :p
* Seamus’ Patronus “was definitely something hairy”. *mind goes into the gutter*
* Hermione’s Patronus is an otter, even though she’s one of the least otter-like people in the series. On a Doylist level, this is probably because JKR’s favourite animal is the otter, so her author avatar will have one as her Patronus, obviously. On a Watsonian level, perhaps Patronuses don’t represent what your personality is like, but what you need to guard you and keep you out of trouble. So Hermione’s is an otter because she needs fun-loving people around her to stop her getting too serious about everything, Ron’s is a weasel because he needs smart people to compensate for his mental inadequacy, and Harry’s is a stag because he needs a proper father-figure to help him, not an abusive one like Uncle Vernon or a scheming and manipulative one like Dumbledore. Patronuses which change when somebody falls in love show that their caster needs to be loved by their intended in order to feel happy and secure again.
* Dobby appears, wearing “his usual eight woollen hats”. I quite like the suggestion that it was this sight that made Hermione drop her SPEW activities, as she saw that her hats were all going to this one elf, and that they were therefore pretty useless from a freeing people standpoint. (Can anybody remember if SPEW is brought up again in this book?)
* Umbridge is here! I bet it’s times like this that the DA wish they had a second, secret entrance from the ROR. That way they could slip away while Umbridge and her cronies sat uselessly in front of the main entrance.
* Draco’s concealed “beneath an ugly dragon-shaped vase”, to match his ugly and monstrous soul.
* Umbridge has “an indecent excitement in her voice”. I wonder if this is how Hermione would sound to those on the receiving end of her little schemes.
* When I first read this scene, I didn’t really mind the “Sneak” curse, because I just sort of assumed that Madam Pomfrey managed to find a way of removing them after a couple of weeks. Then we found out that she still had the scars years later and... yikes.
* Not only is that extremely vindictive, but it doesn’t actually help the DA in any way. It didn’t stop them being betrayed in the first place, and it didn’t alert them to the fact that Umbridge was coming to get them. If this had been a one-off incident and the curse hadn’t been permanent, I’d be inclined to put it down to youthful lack of thought, but when you compare it to some of Hermione’s other actions (her treatment of Rita Skeeter, or sending those canaries after Ron), it seems like a rather worrying pattern is starting to emerge...
* Minerva gets all self-righteous about Willy Widdershins being let off. I wonder whether she feels the same about Mundungus Fletcher, or whether petty crooks are OK just as long as they’re on her side.
* Also, she’s not above a bit of petty corruption herself, since she lets Gryffindor Quidditch players off homework when a match is coming up.
* So Kingsley memory-wipes Marietta to stop her telling. You know, this is exactly the sort of mentality that leads DEs to Imperius people and get them to do their bidding: not caring about your victims’ autonomy, just violating their minds when it’s convenient to do so.
* Also, if they are going to mind-wipe Marietta, why not do it to Percy, Fudge and Umbridge too? That would get them out of trouble entirely.
* And really guys, Umbridge has a list of DA members and access to Veritaserum. Obliviating one witness shouldn’t be enough.
* I’m surprised Umbridge thought she could get away with manhandling students like that in front of Dumbledore. I mean, that man’s just so concerned about his students’ welfare.
* Hermione left the membership list pinned to the ROR wall. Well done, Hermione. Not that any DA members will point out this idiocy to her. Nor will they point out the fact that her defensive jinx was (a) vindictive and useless, and (b) not told about to them when they joined up. Maybe they’re all worried she’ll brand the word “COMPLAINER” across their forehead if they speak up.
* Dumbledore taking the rap is all very noble and everything, but I don’t see how it’s meant to help. Fudge can still charge the pupils with attending, even if they didn’t organise it, and now Dumbledore’s ensured that he’s going to be on the run and unable to give them any help.
* Face-scarring aside, I actually quite liked this chapter. It was quite well-paced, and I never really felt like I was wading through pages of filler. It will be interesting to see if the other chapters will be more like this now the book’s reaching its climax, or whether the quality will slip back down again.
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Re: Marietta's real crime?
Date: 2011-10-03 11:37 pm (UTC)Re: Marietta's real crime?
Date: 2011-10-06 12:05 pm (UTC)No, Ron's insensitivity is canon. He needed a user's manual to chat up girls in book 7, after all. That supports Hermione's accusation perfectly.
Hermione's laughter at Umbridge's trauma is such an example.
Well, all the kids are little hellions when it comes to that passage. Consider it a precursor to the gales of mirth from all concerned whenever Ginny displays her mean thuggish humour in the next book.
But Umbridge was a BAD PERSON, remember; she was going to crucio Harry, she tried to kill him with dementors, she scarred him for life. Laughing at her after she got discredited is small potatoes.
Re: Marietta's real crime?
Date: 2011-10-06 02:12 pm (UTC)Re: Marietta's real crime?
Date: 2011-10-06 07:30 pm (UTC)But it does fit in with the rest of the books - e.g., ignore the crying flayed baby, don't try to help it, because it's hopeless (which we know... how? has anyone ever tried?) and it's a BAD PERSON. Everyone knows it's okay to enjoy the pain of bad people with no reservations whatsoever, right? And that they can never be helped and will never feel remorse unless they were born wimpy (Draco) or fall in love (Snape)? So it's totally fine not to feel the same automatic empathy for other human beings that even babies other than Tom Riddle are capable of.
Re: Marietta's real crime?
Date: 2011-10-06 10:19 pm (UTC)Re: Marietta's real crime?
Date: 2011-10-07 03:46 pm (UTC)Actually, no. It shows that Ron wants to please Hermione, to make her consider him as a romantic partner. He's not just chatting up any girl, after all. He wants his relationship with Hermione to progress and to do that, he has to train himself to be more sensitive to her point of view. He has to change for her.
And, frankly, this is what she demands. She doesn't change who she is for him. She has taken care of him and taken over when it suited her, so washing his underwear is just like doing his homework or Confunding his potential rival. But she won't have him until he "changes" or she convinces herself that he has. She convinces herself that the remarks about house-elves shows he's changed, when he really hasn't -- because it suits her to move forward with their relationship, when everything is on the brink.
So, much as I hate to defend Ron, lazy student who steals from his charges, crummy friend who only seems to care about eating, lying husband who cheats on his driver's exam... he is not all that insensitive when it comes to Hermione. She's the insensitive one. It's her way or the cold shoulder.
Re: Marietta's real crime?
Date: 2011-10-08 02:13 am (UTC)And the only way he can devise to make those changes ... is to refer to the user's manual. So my point stands. Ron needs a book to tell him what the girl wants.
But she won't have him until he "changes" or she convinces herself that he has.
I remember a big OBHWF worshipper remarking that the R/Hr thing was like a "knight's challenge", something like that; the lady sits in the tower waiting while her knight dashes off and performs various tasks to prove himself and win her favour.
She thought this was a GOOD THING. :-( Proof of OMG our Jo's wonderful writing! :-(
... because it suits her to move forward with their relationship
The thing that really peeved me about R/Hr - asides from its flat out incompatibility and pending failure - was that Hermione was happy to just sit there, for years, waiting for Ron to grow up. Ron's a prat - Hermione waits. Ron's jealous - Hermione waits. Ron takes up with Lavender - Hermione waits. Rowling had her (and Ginny) parked in orbits around her boys. The girls were going nowhere, just waiting for the boys to wake up and grab their prizes. No pressure, Harry, Ron, the girls will be there when you want them. Bleh.
Re: Marietta's real crime?
Date: 2011-10-08 05:39 pm (UTC)Probably not, but like the luck potion, it gives him confidence. My point is, at least Ron is sensitive to the fact that he needs to learn more and understand what is supposedly a witch's point of view. I don't think he's a knight, just an average guy without a clue who finally realizes he has to let Hermione think she's the one riding the horse. (And honestly, if there was a book that could tell me how to get through to the SO in my life, I might be tempted to put aside my innate skepticism and read it.)
I hate R/Hr as much as you, but it was the basic dishonesty, disrespect and manipulation by both parties that made me hate R/Hr, not Hermione's "waiting" (which she did with Krum, McClaggen, her "brilliance," and at least the perception of Harry Potter waiting in the wings).
Re: Marietta's real crime?
Date: 2011-10-09 09:21 pm (UTC)Something he couldn't get without the instruction manual, yeah.
it was the basic dishonesty, disrespect and manipulation by both parties that made me hate R/Hr
And the book is a part of that. It wasn't a show-stopper, but I did cringe slightly when Ron would complement Hermione in DH with Harry considering the source of his artificial inspiration. Backed up by Harry saying something nice to Mrs. Weasley and Ron giving him the thumbs-up, whispering 'good one'. Ugh.
Even more creepy when one considers that Ron gave the book to Harry to facilitate his landing a girl ... when said girl is HIS SISTER. I think even Rowling veered off that, in that she had Ron's 'approval' articulated with the object of Harry's attention Mrs. Weasley rather than Ginny. Change the target to Harry's actual love interest and ... ewww. Ron's a procurer for his sister. Yuck.
not Hermione's "waiting" (which she did with Krum, McClaggen, her "brilliance," and at least the perception of Harry Potter waiting in the wings).
I mentioned the theory of that OBHWF pro-Jo zealot in my previous comment ... I think the true R/Hr faithful believe that it was 'always' going to be R/Hr - Ron's jealousy/big brother act guaranteed this, I believe, convincing them it was so - and I don't think the books upset that faith. Hermione only ever was a pen-friend to Krum, McClaggen was clearly not a boyfriend, nor Harry. In the eyes of the OBHWF fans Hermione was stuck in an orbit around Won Won, with her ready and waiting at his convenience.