OOTP Chapter Twenty-Eight: "Snape's Worst Memory"

[for-diddled.livejournal.com]

* An unusually long spork, this -- I'm afraid I had rather a lot of bile to get out...

* So why did the headmaster’s office seal itself against Umbridge? Does it have some way of telling who the “true” head is? But then, Snape seems to have been able to use it without any difficulty, and none of the good guys seem to have thought that he was the true head. Besides, how would the room tell who’s the legitimate headmaster? Umbridge is the legal head of the school, but apparently that’s not good enough. Maybe it has some way of reading people’s characters, or something.

* More importantly, how come the DA members have apparently got off scot free? OK, attending an illegal organisation isn’t quite as bad as organising one, but it’s still pretty bad, and it’d still give Umbridge an excuse to expel them all.

* Hermione gets very angry at the thought of Umbridge lording it over everybody. Only Hermione’s allowed to do that, dammit!

* “‘It’s only teachers who can dock points from houses, Malfoy,’ said Ernie at once.” Except that we saw Percy taking points off Ron in COS. Continuity? What continuity?

* Also, we never had any real indication that Malfoy was being particularly unfair in carrying out his prefect duties before, so why the sudden “I don’t like you, so five points off Gryffindor”? Maybe prefects can (or would, if there were any continuity) only take a set number of points off for certain infractions (e.g., five for wearing your uniform incorrectly, ten for wandering around after lights out, etc.), whereas IS members can take off however many points they want for whatever behaviour they want, and Draco’s on a bit of a power trip here.

* Fred and George have thrown Montague into the Vanishing Cabinet for trying to take a few House Points. You’d have thought that two legal adults would act in a more mature way, but then JK Rowling always had funny ideas about behaviour.

* Also, they’re “coolly” discussing the prospect of him being missing for weeks, just like James and Sirius will later be “coolly” deciding how to humiliate Severus. Looks like the people who consider the Marauders to be the forerunners of the Weasley twins were right.

* OK, regarding Filch: first of all, if he likes Umbridge so much, she’s clearly not being overtly prejudiced towards him, despite apparently being the sort of nasty racist who’d hate Squibs like him. (Compare that to Harry, who thinks it’s fine to Hex him from behind in front of a laughing audience.) Secondly, from what we see of Hogwarts, maybe the pupils would benefit from a little extra discipline. (Or maybe it’s just Dumbledore’s favourites who are let off, we don’t really know.) Thirdly, expelling Peeves? Good. About time somebody did.

* Umbridge has got the confiscated brooms chained to her wall. I wonder if she keeps them there all the time to gloat at how she’s spoiling everybody’s fun. Or maybe she brought them up specially to help interrogate Harry. If for some reason the Veritaserum doesn’t work, she can shave bits of wood off until Harry cracks and tells her everything she wants to know.

* I’m not sure why the kittens are described as “foul”. Are they wallowing in the blood of dead mice, or something? Or maybe Harry doesn’t like cats. JKR doesn’t seem to be an animals sort of person, and nor do any of her characters.

* Umbridge isn’t exactly being subtle about her attempts to drug Harry. Looks like she learnt her evil planning skills at the same school as Voldemort and Lucius Malfoy.

* Of course, if Umbridge were at all subtle and intelligent, she wouldn’t go around telling people that their correspondence is being watched. That’s pretty much the surest way to make sure they don’t write anything incriminating.

* The fireworks are kind of cool, but they also highlight a problem with the way Umbridge’s régime is portrayed. JKR seems to want us to view her as this sinister Orwellian figure making everybody’s life a misery, but she constantly undercuts this when all her characters do these zany stunts to annoy her. It’s kinda like if Winston in Nineteen Eighty-Four were taken to the Ministry of Love to be tortured, and spent all his time blowing raspberries at the guards.

* Harry’s finding it very difficult to “empty his mind of all thoughts”. That’s quite surprising, given that there isn’t really much to empty.

* “A lovely person who made a mistake?” Yeah, Harry, that’s right, nice people never do the wrong things sometimes, so if anybody ever does make a mistake, they’re clearly evil and must never be forgiven. Actually, I think that sort of thinking might be a symptom of some personality disorders...

* Finally somebody criticises Hermione’s jinx idea! Well done, Cho, nice to see that at least one character in these books has got their head screwed on properly.

* Also, it should perhaps be noted that Harry cuts off Cho twice when she tries to defend Marietta. We don’t know what Cho would have said if she’d been allowed to speak, so I don’t think we can draw too many conclusions as to what her motives were.

* I don’t think Malfoy ever tells anyone about Harry’s “remedial Potions” lessons, does he? It’s almost as if his life isn’t quite to dedicated to annoying Harry as some people make out.

* Also, Harry’s wishing he could Curse Malfoy now. One of the things about the Gallant!Crucio scene is that it makes all these incidents look rather sinister in retrospect, when normally I’d probably just dismiss them as being idle daydreams of the “One of these days I’ll really give that person a piece of my mind…” variety.

* Harry’s looking into Snape’s private memories while Snape is off helping the victims of a couple of Harry’s friends’ pranks. Our hero, ladies and gentlemen.

* Snape’s written more in his exam than everybody, and his writing’s really tiny to boot. This is probably meant to show that he’s got an unhealthy knowledge of the dark arts, although he never gives the impression of being more into evil magic than Harry (who repeatedly fantasises about torturing and cursing people, actually tortures somebody in DH, and feels a strong attachment to Teenage!Voldemort in COS) or Hermione (who scars people’s faces, conjures up canaries to attack her best friend, and laughs at a PTSD sufferer lying in hospital).

* Apparently “a girl sitting behind [Sirius] was eyeing him hopefully, but he didn’t seem to have noticed.” Sorry girl, Sirius has eyes for Remus and Remus alone.

* It seems that Harry’s temporarily forgotten his own mother’s name, given that he can’t work out what the letters “L.E.” might stand for.

* James has drawn a Snitch as well. Perhaps we’re meant to infer that, as the stereotypical jerk-jock-type character, he’s interested in nothing but sport and women.

* Lupin casually chats about his own werewolfism, making me wonder how he could have kept it a secret for so long, given that he clearly doesn’t make much effort to stop anybody from knowing.

* Also, Pettigrew isn’t necessarily that thick: to know the differences between a werewolf and a real wolf, you’d have to know what both are like, so hanging around a werewolf every month wouldn’t be enough to answer the question.

* Does anybody know whether the differences Pettigrew lists are real differences in folklore, or did JK Rowling just make them up herself?

* I was only about ten when this book came out, but even then I remember being distinctly unimpressed with James’ “nicked it” line. Going around stealing stuff isn’t something you should be proud of, Potter.

* Really, Wormtail, what’s with all this gasping and applauding? I know that you’re probably just allowed to hang out with James and Sirius because your sycophancy stokes their egos, but still, try and behave with a little bit of dignity.

* If Snape is even aware of the Marauders’ presence, he doesn’t show it, and Sirius is described as “like a dog that has scented a rabbit”. IOW, this assault was entirely unprovoked; the Marauders aren’t in any way defending themselves, or even launching a pre-emptive strike to stop Snape from attacking them.

* “‘Well,’ said James, appearing to deliberate the point, ‘it’s more the fact that he exists, if you know what I mean...’” Pardon me while I just go and vomit in disgust.

* Also, imagine if Draco Malfoy had said that about Harry or Hermione, he’d be condemned as a dirty bigoted pureblood supremacist, and quite rightly, too. But when James says it, it’s somehow OK. Bullying is OK if it’s a popular person bullying an unpopular person, clearly.

* Also note how, pace his fans’ selective memories, James doesn’t say “That Snape person is always attacking us whenever he gets the chance, we need to show him that we can defend ourselves.”

* Note the use of adverbs such as “coolly” and “coldly”. James and Sirius clearly aren’t acting on passion here; they’re doing it calmly, methodically, and with a total disregard for the feelings of their victim. Sort of like how you’d expect psychopaths to behave, in fact.

* Lily’s face “had twitched for an instant as though she were going to smile”. So her best friend is being publicly humiliated, and she’s using the opportunity to flirt with the person bullying him. I’m left wondering how it is that (a) everybody talks about her in such glowing terms, and (b) Snape ever saw anything in her in the first place.

* Snape’s just been publicly humiliated – hexed by James and Sirius, and then saved by a Gryffindor, and a Gryffindor girl at that. You know, Lily, maybe he’s not quite thinking straight at this moment. Even if you decide you don’t want to be friends with him (although if you abandon your friends based on a heat-of-the-moment insult like that, you’re probably not such a good friend after all), there’s no call to join in the humiliation.

* James is upset, so takes it out on somebody who’s powerless to stop him, i.e., Snape. Classic bully behaviour there, although you ask the fans and they’ll come up with various ways of rationalising his behaviour. (“Oh, he was just angry that Snape had called Lily a ‘Mudblood’...” Yeah, right.)

* “Who wants to see me take off Snivelly’s pants?” Again, despite what the fans say, this isn’t normal schoolboy bully behaviour. This is fairly serious sexual abuse, of the sort which can scar somebody for life. Heck, I seem to recall a fairly major scandal when it turned out that British and American soldiers had been doing similar things to Iraqi prisoners...

* Note how Lupin the prefect has been sitting quietly on the side-lines, not doing anything to stop his friends’ bullying. Are we really sure that he belongs in the House of the Brave?

* This whole scene has been so one-sided that I have difficulty believing the story that Snape went around hexing James and making his life a misery (which conveniently all happens off-screen, leaving us to see only the scenes which make James look like the bully). Judging by his performance here, he doesn’t really look capable of taking the Marauders on. Although I suppose he might have improved his fighting skills after the incident, hence all his new spells being written in a NEWT-level book rather than an OWL-level one. James’ alleged “reformation” might also have been motivated in part by the knowledge that Snape was now capable of giving as good as he got in a fight.

* And James apparently managed to keep his fights with Snape a secret from Lily in seventh year, which would be quite hard to do unless they were all in places and times of James’ choosing – unless, in other words, they were started by James.

* It would be quite easy to do this, given that James had access to the Marauders’ Map, allowing him to get Snape when he was alone, and the Invisibility Cloak, allowing him to sneak up on Snape. James could have made Snape’s life hell if he chose to, and judging by his behaviour here, that’s exactly what he would have done.

* Also, note how Snape never, despite all the provocation, reveals that Lupin is a werewolf. Why is this? Did Dumbledore make him sign an Unbreakable Vow not to tell anyone? Is James acting like this because, having got away with the “Prank”, he now reckons he can get away with anything?

* Also, Lily implies in DH that she doesn’t want to be friends with Snape anymore because Snape’s friends are all into the Dark Arts, but how could what they were doing be worse than what we see of James’ and Sirius’ behaviour?

* And Lily goes out with James in seventh year, and gets married to him just after leaving school, yes? So James presumably “reforms” himself in sixth year or early in seventh year. I don’t know about everybody else, but if I saw someone treating my friends (or even just random strangers) like James treats Severus, I’d wait a lot longer than a year to go out with him, even if he did claim to be better-behaved now.

* And why the hell was James made Head Boy? Sure he might have reformed, but weren’t there kids who’d been good (or at least not borderline sociopaths) since coming to Hogwarts? Was it a bribe not to tell anybody that Dumbles was harbouring a werewolf in the school?

* I’ve literally no idea what JK Rowling was thinking when she was writing this chapter. On the one hand, Harry seems genuinely horrified at his father’s behaviour, so we clearly aren’t meant to see this as a childish prank or righteous punishment of a nasty pupil. On the other hand, it seems to have virtually no effects on the plot or Harry’s characterisation. He never thinks “All these people said my parents were awesome people, this is clearly wrong, so maybe I should be less trusting of the other things that they tell me,” or “Snape clearly had an unhappy childhood, maybe I shouldn’t blame him for being so bitter and abrasive,” or “Since Snape clearly didn’t have a happy time at Hogwarts, maybe he joined the DEs because they were the only group that offered him protection and belonging, rather than because he was evil.” Instead he breaks into Umbridge’s office to ask Sirius and... well, forgets about it, really. Maybe this was one of the plot threads that got dropped after JKR suffered burnout, or something.

Comments

[ladyhadhafang.livejournal.com]

*Claps* Well-said. Seriously. :)

[lynn-waterfall.livejournal.com]

Also, Pettigrew isn’t necessarily that thick: to know the differences between a werewolf and a real wolf, you’d have to know what both are like, so hanging around a werewolf every month wouldn’t be enough to answer the question.

Yes, exactly! Thank you for making this point -- so many people overlook it.

It's also worth noting that there aren't any normal wolves in the wild in Britain, anymore, which means that 1) Peter almost certainly wouldn't've seen a real wolf, and 2) if you're in Britain and see a wolf free, something is wrong; you don't need to know the visual differences unless you leave the country.

Part 1

[oryx_leucoryx]

So why did the headmaster’s office seal itself against Umbridge? Does it have some way of telling who the “true” head is? But then, Snape seems to have been able to use it without any difficulty, and none of the good guys seem to have thought that he was the true head.

Severus managed to enter the office even before his official appointment: He was there before the 7P battle in late July, his appointment was announced at the end of August (and in any case was after the takeover of the Ministry on August 1st).

It is possible that during the summer he just flew into the office through the window. (Was it left open since June? Did he Alohomora it from the air?) But during the school year he must have been able to enter it normally. Is it because Severus was appointed by the board of governors while Umbridge was only appointed by the Minister? Is it because Albus discussed Severus' future headmastership in the office (as we see once in The Prince's Tale) so the office knew his appointment was what Albus desired?

I don’t think Malfoy ever tells anyone about Harry’s “remedial Potions” lessons, does he? It’s almost as if his life isn’t quite to dedicated to annoying Harry as some people make out.

Nice! Had Draco been such a dedicated enemy of Harry's there'd have been gossip about those lessons all over school.

This is probably meant to show that he’s got an unhealthy knowledge of the dark arts

As opposed to Hermione's over-long essays on various topics? Anyway, I doubt OWL questions were about how to perform Dark Magic, more about how to protect oneself from it.

Sorry girl, Sirius has eyes for Remus and Remus alone.

Actually I think James was Sirius' true love. Unrequited, probably.

It seems that Harry’s temporarily forgotten his own mother’s name, given that he can’t work out what the letters “L.E.” might stand for.

He never knew her maiden name, which was also Petunia's maiden name, because Rowling only came up with it for this book. (And messed things up by having a 10 year old boy named Mark Evans be Dudley's victim in this very book. Some fans were expecting him to show up as a first year in Book 6.)

James has drawn a Snitch as well. Perhaps we’re meant to infer that, as the stereotypical jerk-jock-type character, he’s interested in nothing but sport and women.

More than that: He thinks of Lily as something he needs to chase and catch before his rival does, not as a person with choices of her own.

I’m left wondering how it is that (a) everybody talks about her in such glowing terms, and (b) Snape ever saw anything in her in the first place.

a- Are you asking about fans or characters? The only characters who praise her at all are Hagrid and Horace. As for fans, that was before we knew she had once been 'best friends' with Severus.

b- It mostly shows how damaged he was by his upbringing.

“Who wants to see me take off Snivelly’s pants?” Again, despite what the fans say, this isn’t normal schoolboy bully behaviour. This is fairly serious sexual abuse, of the sort which can scar somebody for life.

Let nobody forget, the 'pants' in question are underwear, not what USians call 'pants' ('trousers' for Brits).

Note how Lupin the prefect has been sitting quietly on the side-lines, not doing anything to stop his friends’ bullying. Are we really sure that he belongs in the House of the Brave?

If any of the quartet was 'sorted too soon' it was him rather than Peter. But really, both had physical bravery. It's the moral kind they were short on.

Although I suppose he might have improved his fighting skills after the incident, hence all his new spells being written in a NEWT-level book rather than an OWL-level one.

Supposedly Levicorpus was popular when they were in 5th year, so he was using the NEWT level book before he started NEWT-level classes.

It would be quite easy to do this, given that James had access to the Marauders’ Map, allowing him to get Snape when he was alone, and the Invisibility Cloak, allowing him to sneak up on Snape.

Also had access to a mirror-communication device through which he could have been warned of approaching teachers by a friend.

Re: Part 1

[sharaz-jek.livejournal.com]

It would be quite easy to do this, given that James had access to the Marauders’ Map, allowing him to get Snape when he was alone, and the Invisibility Cloak, allowing him to sneak up on Snape.

Also had access to a mirror-communication device through which he could have been warned of approaching teachers by a friend.

This is approaching James Bond levels of equipment. If schoolchildren can obtain and make these, why are the adults so useless?

Re: Part 1

[detritius.livejournal.com]

But really, both had physical bravery. It's the moral kind they were short on.

I think that's true of what we see of most Gryffindors in the books. They may be willing as anything to fight or take stupid risks, but when it comes to standing up to their friends or admitting that they were wrong, they're cowards to a man. The only exception I can think of is Neville.

Re: Part 1

[oneandthetruth.livejournal.com]

Actually I think James was Sirius' true love. Unrequited, probably.

I read a fanfic that proposed the real reason James and Sirius (or maybe it was just Sirius) bullied Severus so mercilessly was because they were attracted to him, but he was so hung up on Lily, he couldn't be bothered with them. So they took out their rage and frustration at being rejected by bullying him.

Re: Part 1

[charlottehywd.livejournal.com]

Let nobody forget, the 'pants' in question are underwear, not what USians call 'pants' ('trousers' for Brits).

OK, that is incredibly creepy. The fact that Lily stood by and even laughed a little at seeing her friend humiliated in a near-sexual way is even more so. Seriously, Lily and James deserved each other. And Harry apparently inherited some of their worst traits. And people wonder why I hate this series so much. Gah!

Part 2

[oryx_leucoryx]

Why is this? Did Dumbledore make him sign an Unbreakable Vow not to tell anyone?

Or threatened to expel him. Whatever he did, Severus didn't tell Lucius or other DEs, even after school, but he was capable of leaking the information to the Slytherins.

but how could what they were doing be worse than what we see of James’ and Sirius’ behaviour?

Because some spells have cooties. James' apparently don't, no matter how actually damaging they were.

Was it a bribe not to tell anybody that Dumbles was harbouring a werewolf in the school?

Or a prize for allowing Dumbles to keep the story hidden (by avoiding a situation of a dead student).

Re: Part 2

[danajsparks.livejournal.com]

----but he was capable of leaking the information to the Slytherins.

I've questioned whether this is actually how the Slytherins found out. Remus tells Harry that Snape told the Slytherins, but Remus is far from a reliable source of information. It think it's more likely that the Slytherins figured out on their own that Remus was a werewolf because they did the essay that Snape assigned, like Hermione did. All Snape then had to tell his students was something like, "There was an incident last night because Prof. Lupin forgot to take his regular potion."

[sharaz-jek.livejournal.com]

* So why did the headmaster’s office seal itself against Umbridge? Does it have some way of telling who the “true” head is? But then, Snape seems to have been able to use it without any difficulty, and none of the good guys seem to have thought that he was the true head. Besides, how would the room tell who’s the legitimate headmaster? Umbridge is the legal head of the school, but apparently that’s not good enough. Maybe it has some way of reading people’s characters, or something.

Maybe it needs the governors' approval? Umbridge was installed via Educational Decree, IIRC.

* Fred and George have thrown Montague into the Vanishing Cabinet for trying to take a few House Points. You’d have thought that two legal adults would act in a more mature way, but then JK Rowling always had funny ideas about behaviour.

* Also, they’re “coolly” discussing the prospect of him being missing for weeks, just like James and Sirius will later be “coolly” deciding how to humiliate Severus. Looks like the people who consider the Marauders to be the forerunners of the Weasley twins were right.

And next year they'll be selling date-rape potions (which inexplicably are legal and not counted as Dark Magic. Go figure).

* The fireworks are kind of cool, but they also highlight a problem with the way Umbridge’s régime is portrayed. JKR seems to want us to view her as this sinister Orwellian figure making everybody’s life a misery, but she constantly undercuts this when all her characters do these zany stunts to annoy her. It’s kinda like if Winston in Nineteen Eighty-Four were taken to the Ministry of Love to be tortured, and spent all his time blowing raspberries at the guards.

Hey, if protesting against oppressive systems actually took resolve and dedication, Gryffindors wouldn't bother!

* Also, note how Snape never, despite all the provocation, reveals that Lupin is a werewolf. Why is this? Did Dumbledore make him sign an Unbreakable Vow not to tell anyone? Is James acting like this because, having got away with the “Prank”, he now reckons he can get away with anything?

The great mystery of the ages. Clearly Snape was just the bigger man. (Although why James and Sirius would attack someone who could get them expelled at best and imprisoned at worst, and why Lupin would let them when his soul might conceivably be at Snape's mercy, is another great mystery.)

Everything you say about the Marauders' conduct is brilliant, but I do have to take issue with one thing.

* Snape’s just been publicly humiliated – hexed by James and Sirius, and then saved by a Gryffindor, and a Gryffindor girl at that. You know, Lily, maybe he’s not quite thinking straight at this moment. Even if you decide you don’t want to be friends with him (although if you abandon your friends based on a heat-of-the-moment insult like that, you’re probably not such a good friend after all), there’s no call to join in the humiliation.

Given that Snape's been hanging out with proto-DEs* for protection and that at this point they are public in their aims and ideology (I think), the strength of her reaction is understandable**. What she does next, of course - she's a prefect! What sort of responsibility was she bringing to her duties?

* Although on reflection, I don't think their politics at this point are ever identified - they're allegedly into Dark Magic (at least, Mulciber is - and as you said, how can it be any worse than this, especially since Snape can claim to Lily that it was funny), but it's unclear whether they were going around espousing pureblood supremacy.
** Or at least it is if you assume that anti-Muggleborn prejudice worked similarly to any real-world prejudice. Based on these books, Rowling seems to believe that racism consists solely of racial slurs and sending people to the camps***. Facing real oppression would have been too much hard work for our Hermione.
*** Or to beg on the streets, which weakens her Nazi Germany parallels somewhat.

[for-diddled.livejournal.com]

"at this point they are public in their aims and ideology (I think),"

I'm not sure how open they are about their ideology at this point, but I don't think the first incarnation of the Death Eaters was overtly racist. They let the half-blood Snape join, after all, and Hagrid expressed surprise that Voldemort had never tried to recruit Lilly or James to his cause. Possibly the blood purity angle only became important after Voldemort's return, when his old followers didn't flock to his banner as he'd expected and he consequently had to find supporters wherever he could.

[majorjune.livejournal.com]

Hey, if protesting against oppressive systems actually took resolve and dedication, Gryffindors wouldn't bother!

Heh! Coincidentally, I posted the following today:

http://majorjune.livejournal.com/72022.html

[oryx_leucoryx]

According to Sirius the original official line was about getting rid of Muggle-borns and putting purebloods in charge. But the 'getting rid of' sounds more like not letting them attend Hogwarts or hold government jobs than killing them. It was a rather common and unexceptional political view. At the time of SWM members of the Marauders' cohort were 15-16, so it had to be at least a year before Regulus' recruitment. Even then the DEs were not yet widely known to have been killing people, or at least not many of them.

[charlottehywd.livejournal.com]

Wait... date rape potions? How did I miss that?

[mary-j-59.livejournal.com]

Brilliant! You make a lot of good points here. The utter lack of continuity in these books is maddening.

Also, this made me laugh! It seems that Harry’s temporarily forgotten his own mother’s name, given that he can’t work out what the letters “L.E.” might stand for.

[sigune.livejournal.com]

I refused to believe the Snape/Lily theories that were floating around after this book came out, because I read the worst memory scene the same way that you did. I couldn't believe, from that scene, that Lily could have cared about Snape at all.

For me, the "Worst Memory" part was clearly about the bullying, and at that point, I thought JKR was being pretty brave, subverting James's sainted image. Only, as it turned out, she thought he was an all-right bloke O_O.

This chapter is actually what turned me into a staunch Snape fan.

[oryx_leucoryx]

Only, as it turned out, she thought he was an all-right bloke O_O.

I think the Rowling-bot response is that while here Harry is shocked with how his father behaved, in DH he learned that little Sev was a pervert who was stalking Lily, and then he scared Petunia about wizards and was the reason for her subsequent poor treatment of Harry so he deserved everything James did to him. Or something.

[aikaterini.livejournal.com]

/I refused to believe the Snape/Lily theories that were floating around after this book came out, because I read the worst memory scene the same way that you did. I couldn't believe, from that scene, that Lily could have cared about Snape at all./

That’s what I thought, too! When I saw all of the Severus/Lily theories floating around after OotP, I kept thinking, “Umm, guys, you do realize that Lily never gave any sign of knowing Snape, right?” She was only talking to James; her attention was all on him. I thought that that was the point of the scene: James and Lily’s contentious relationship. Nothing in that scene gave me any indication that Lily knew Snape personally. To me, Lily was just a prefect coming to help a random student that she barely knew. The main points were that James bullied Severus and that Lily and James didn’t like each other before getting married. So, when I read “The Prince’s Tale” in DH, I couldn’t believe that the shippers were right. It honestly felt like reading fanfiction.

IOIAGDI

[urbanman1984.livejournal.com]

>>>>> * And why the hell was James made Head Boy? Sure he might have reformed, but weren’t there kids who’d been good (or at least not borderline sociopaths) since coming to Hogwarts? Was it a bribe not to tell anybody that Dumbles was harbouring a werewolf in the school? <<<<<<

Because James was going to join the Order and finance it too. How much he might have financed it is pondered in the professional standard fanfic, The Best Revenge.


>> * Also, imagine if Draco Malfoy had said that about Harry or Hermione, he’d be condemned as a dirty bigoted pureblood supremacist, and quite rightly, too. But when James says it, it’s somehow OK. Bullying is OK if it’s a popular person bullying an unpopular person, clearly. <<

Oh dear, you have forgotten the most important aspect of morality in the Potterverse - It's Okay If A Gryffindor Does It!! If someone has been sorted into Gryffindor House then whatever they do is moral. They are the elect, remember? That explains a lot about the series that would not make sense otherwise. It also explains why Lily is the icon of selfless love in the series even though she treats Snape like dirt and is in essence just another Petunia only with the added attributes of pretty looks and magic powers.

Re: IOIAGDI

[oryx_leucoryx]

I can't believe the Order ever needed financing. What did they do that required anything people didn't already have or would have gotten anyway for their normal daily activities? OK, what did they do, period?

[danajsparks.livejournal.com]

It's interesting how so many of the most morally questionable moments of the entire series happen within just two consecutive chapters- this one and the previous one. It makes me wonder about Rowling's mood when she was writing them. Was she feeling particularly angry or vindictive at the time?

Part 1

[aikaterini.livejournal.com]

/Well done, Cho, nice to see that at least one character in these books has got their head screwed on properly./

True, but this is what causes the break-up of their relationship. The price Cho pays for being loyal to her friend rather than accept Harry’s excuses about Hermione is no longer being Harry’s girlfriend – thus no longer needing to be relevant to the story (except for her inexplicable appearance in DH).

Not that I blame her, though. Seriously, Harry doesn’t try to understand Cho at *all* in this scene. When Cho protests that what Hermione did was terrible, he just coolly says, “I thought that it was brilliant.” And then instead of Cho pointing out what that said about him, she falls back on mentioning Hermione, so that Harry can just think that she’s jealous that he spends more time with Hermione than with her, instead of being legitimately angry that her boyfriend doesn’t seem to care that his friend hurt her friend.

/Also, it should perhaps be noted that Harry cuts off Cho twice when she tries to defend Marietta. We don’t know what Cho would have said if she’d been allowed to speak, so I don’t think we can draw too many conclusions as to what her motives were./

The same can be said for Snape during the confrontation scene with Lily. Neither Harry nor Lily seems to realize that by cutting Snape/Cho off instead of hearing what they have to say, they look more like rude aggressors who refuse to listen to the people that they supposedly care about.

/this assault was entirely unprovoked; the Marauders aren’t in any way defending themselves, or even launching a pre-emptive strike to stop Snape from attacking them./

Of course, it’s pre-emptive; Snape loves the Dark Arts! He loves them so much; he just goes around hexing people for the fun of it, casting Unforgiveable Curses at people just because they annoy him or because they insult people he likes, and permanently scarring people for life! It’s totally justified! Who knows what he was secretly plotting before the Marauders caught him in time? You always have to watch out for the quiet ones, after all. Good thing that they caught him before he could even think about hexing some poor Muggle-born. He’s got those racist friends, you know, so obviously every breath he takes is a nefarious sign that he’ll do something horrible. He was asking for it! *sarcasm*

/“‘Well,’ said James, appearing to deliberate the point, ‘it’s more the fact that he exists, if you know what I mean...’” Pardon me while I just go and vomit in disgust./

Oh, yeah, Snape only hated James because he was “jealous” of James’ talent on the Quidditch field and he’s so petty for hanging onto a “schoolboy grudge.” Care to repeat that, Remus?

/imagine if Draco Malfoy had said that about Harry or Hermione, he’d be condemned as a dirty bigoted pureblood supremacist, and quite rightly, too. But when James says it, it’s somehow OK. Bullying is OK if it’s a popular person bullying an unpopular person, clearly./

*flatly* If Draco had done *half* of what Lily and the Marauders do in this scene, he’d be crucified by most of the fandom as an irredeemable bully (not that he isn’t thought as one already). But no, James is a Gryffindor and Harry’s dad, so, obviously, he’s supposed to be the good guy in all of this.

Re: Part 1

[oneandthetruth.livejournal.com]

/Also, it should perhaps be noted that Harry cuts off Cho twice when she tries to defend Marietta. We don’t know what Cho would have said if she’d been allowed to speak, so I don’t think we can draw too many conclusions as to what her motives were./

The same can be said for Snape during the confrontation scene with Lily. Neither Harry nor Lily seems to realize that by cutting Snape/Cho off instead of hearing what they have to say, they look more like rude aggressors who refuse to listen to the people that they supposedly care about.

Good catch! I hadn't seen that parallel. Apparently Harry is his mother's son in more than eye color. No wonder he's such an unpleasant screwup--he was genetically doomed at the moment of conception. ;-)

*flatly* If Draco had done *half* of what Lily and the Marauders do in this scene, he’d be crucified by most of the fandom as an irredeemable bully (not that he isn’t thought as one already). But no, James is a Gryffindor and Harry’s dad, so, obviously, he’s supposed to be the good guy in all of this.

But--but--James reformed! Jo told us so! The fact he got better later automatically invalidates all the bad stuff he did before he reformed, right? See, that's the difference between him and Draco. JKR didn't tell us he got better, so all the bad stuff he did still stands.

Part 2

[aikaterini.livejournal.com]

/James and Sirius clearly aren’t acting on passion here; they’re doing it calmly, methodically, and with a total disregard for the feelings of their victim. Sort of like how you’d expect psychopaths to behave, in fact./

Or Tom Riddle.

/“Who wants to see me take off Snivelly’s pants?” Again, despite what the fans say, this isn’t normal schoolboy bully behaviour. This is fairly serious sexual abuse/

I agree with oryx_leucoryx; American fans may not see this as such a big deal because for us, “pants” are trousers/jeans. To us, James’ threat would have meant, “I’m going to SHOW Snivelly’s underwear,” not “I’m going to TAKE OFF Snivelly’s underwear.” At least that’s how I interpreted it when I first read this scene.

/Note how Lupin the prefect has been sitting quietly on the side-lines, not doing anything to stop his friends’ bullying./

And Lily, who is also apparently a prefect, does the same – the only difference is that she makes a big show out of doing nothing.

/note how Snape never, despite all the provocation, reveals that Lupin is a werewolf. Why is this? Did Dumbledore make him sign an Unbreakable Vow not to tell anyone?/

That’s what I was wondering, too. That’s why the timeline of this incident is so maddening. Since this happened after the Prank, Snape had every opportunity to yell out that Lupin was a werewolf.

/Is James acting like this because, having got away with the “Prank”, he now reckons he can get away with anything?/

And James should *know* that Snape has every opportunity to yell out that Lupin is a werewolf. Not only does the timeline make him look doubly horrible for doing this – right after Snape was almost killed – but it makes him look like a horrible friend. He seriously doesn’t think that his behavior will cause Snape to blurt out Lupin’s secret? When that was ostensibly the whole *point* of the Prank in the first place, keeping Snape from spilling the beans? I’m wondering now if Snape was indeed forced to swear an Unbreakable Vow to keep silent and James knew about it.

Although given the timing of this scene, now I’m wondering if that’s why Remus is keeping quiet. Is he afraid that if he tries to get involved, Snape will lash out at him by revealing his secret?

/Lily goes out with James in seventh year, and gets married to him just after leaving school, yes? So James presumably “reforms” himself in sixth year or early in seventh year. I don’t know about everybody else, but if I saw someone treating my friends (or even just random strangers) like James treats Severus, I’d wait a lot longer than a year to go out with him, even if he did claim to be better-behaved now./

Which makes her look even shallower than she already does and makes all of her claims to moral superiority utterly hollow. Even if James truly did reform, he had spent the last several years tormenting her *best friend.* If Lily really was the kind friend that we’re supposed to think that she is, she would have waited before getting into such a serious relationship with James. Why did Lily and James feel that it was so necessary to marry right out of high school?

I mean, good grief, Draco has done far less to Ron and Harry than what James has done to Snape and yet many of the Draco/Hermione fanfics that I’ve seen don’t have them hook up and marry immediately after Draco stops being antagonistic to them. Most of the average or good fanfics have them wait and reconcile with each other before tentatively starting to date. If they do get married right away, it’s because of stress and pressure – through an accidental pregnancy, through trying to survive the war together, through the plot convenience of a marriage law (though I haven’t read any fanfics with that premise) – and Hermione’s friendship with Harry and Ron is *always* acknowledged, as is their past with Draco.

/I’ve literally no idea what JK Rowling was thinking when she was writing this chapter./

Neither do I. At first I did think that JKR was trying to subvert our image of James, to show us that he wasn’t such a saint after all…but then it turns out that we’re meant to support Lily dumping Snape for him anyway and view Snape as a pathetic victim of his own prejudice. So, yeah, I have no idea what the point of this was.

Re: Part 2

[oneandthetruth.livejournal.com]

/James and Sirius clearly aren’t acting on passion here; they’re doing it calmly, methodically, and with a total disregard for the feelings of their victim. Sort of like how you’d expect psychopaths to behave, in fact./

Or Tom Riddle.

Who is a psychopath. I've said for a long time that Sirius is definitely a psychopath, and James probably is. The cold, calculating nature of their viciousness, as well as their complete lack of remorse, were major factors in my deciding that.

And Lily, who is also apparently a prefect, does the same – the only difference is that she makes a big show out of doing nothing.

Another good catch. This is the scene that proves James and Lily belong together--because they're both egotistical, disloyal, showoff bullies.

Even if James truly did reform, he had spent the last several years tormenting her *best friend.* If Lily really was the kind friend that we’re supposed to think that she is, she would have waited before getting into such a serious relationship with James.

Leaving her alleged best friend out of it entirely, he also got his kicks tormenting a lot of other kids. You wouldn't catch me dead getting involved with somebody who got their kicks tormenting others. Sooner or later, they could turn that viciousness on you. Even if they don't, they're the moral equivalent of Nazis, many of whom were loving friends and family men while torturing innocent people.

Yeah, you heard me right, JKR butt-bussers! I just compared the "good guys" to Nazis. Stick that where the sun don't shine.

[mmmarcusz.livejournal.com]

* I don’t think Malfoy ever tells anyone about Harry’s “remedial Potions” lessons, does he? It’s almost as if his life isn’t quite to dedicated to annoying Harry as some people make out.

But if Harry thinks about Malfoy wall the time and watches his every action, Malfoy must do the same. He wouldn't ignore him.

* It seems that Harry’s temporarily forgotten his own mother’s name, given that he can’t work out what the letters “L.E.” might stand for.

Oh Harry. What about R.A.B. as well? At least in book 2 Tom Marvolo Riddle wasn't obvious. "You mean Lord Tromedlov was... No! It can't be!"

* Also, Pettigrew isn’t necessarily that thick: to know the differences between a werewolf and a real wolf, you’d have to know what both are like, so hanging around a werewolf every month wouldn’t be enough to answer the question.

* Does anybody know whether the differences Pettigrew lists are real differences in folklore, or did JK Rowling just make them up herself?

Not to mention that Peter has only ever seen a werewolf when he was in rat form (rats have very poor vision and rely mostly on smell), and might not have ever seen a wolf. It would have been good if PP retorted that he could smell the difference a mile off, but JKR can't allow the characters she dislikes to get anything.

* Also, note how Snape never, despite all the provocation, reveals that Lupin is a werewolf. Why is this? Did Dumbledore make him sign an Unbreakable Vow not to tell anyone? Is James acting like this because, having got away with the “Prank”, he now reckons he can get away with anything?

But he reveals it in POA. I like to think that Snape promised, and didn't want to break his word, no matter how awful the people involved were.

* I’ve literally no idea what JK Rowling was thinking when she was writing this chapter. On the one hand, Harry seems genuinely horrified at his father’s behaviour, so we clearly aren’t meant to see this as a childish prank or righteous punishment of a nasty pupil. On the other hand, it seems to have virtually no effects on the plot or Harry’s characterisation. He never thinks “All these people said my parents were awesome people, this is clearly wrong, so maybe I should be less trusting of the other things that they tell me,” or “Snape clearly had an unhappy childhood, maybe I shouldn’t blame him for being so bitter and abrasive,” or “Since Snape clearly didn’t have a happy time at Hogwarts, maybe he joined the DEs because they were the only group that offered him protection and belonging, rather than because he was evil.” Instead he breaks into Umbridge’s office to ask Sirius and... well, forgets about it, really. Maybe this was one of the plot threads that got dropped after JKR suffered burnout, or something.

Isn't there a Potter Puppet Pals where Snape recounts being bullied by James, and Harry barely listens to him and says "Wow! My dad was awesome!" at the end.

* Lily’s face “had twitched for an instant as though she were going to smile”. So her best friend is being publicly humiliated, and she’s using the opportunity to flirt with the person bullying him. I’m left wondering how it is that (a) everybody talks about her in such glowing terms, and (b) Snape ever saw anything in her in the first place.

Why is it that the heroes are so abominable? Pansy Parkinson never did anything nearly as bad as this (even when she said they should hand Harry over to LV, she was being rational -- she had no reason to think the battle was winnable, but handing Harry over would greatly lesson the casualties).

* And James apparently managed to keep his fights with Snape a secret from Lily in seventh year, which would be quite hard to do unless they were all in places and times of James’ choosing – unless, in other words, they were started by James.

I can imagine James on a date with Lily and suddenly getting an urge to beat up on Snape. I can see him glancing at the clock, thinking up excuses to leave early, drifting off into reveries as Lily talks... oh God, it's almost too easy to imagine James the psychopath.

[mmmarcusz.livejournal.com]

* The fireworks are kind of cool, but they also highlight a problem with the way Umbridge’s régime is portrayed. JKR seems to want us to view her as this sinister Orwellian figure making everybody’s life a misery, but she constantly undercuts this when all her characters do these zany stunts to annoy her. It’s kinda like if Winston in Nineteen Eighty-Four were taken to the Ministry of Love to be tortured, and spent all his time blowing raspberries at the guards.

It's like the Death Eater march at the World Cup - "we're out of power now, but the Gryffindors will be in control again soon, so don't you think about slighting us!"

[mmmarcusz.livejournal.com]

So why did the headmaster’s office seal itself against Umbridge? Does it have some way of telling who the “true” head is? But then, Snape seems to have been able to use it without any difficulty, and none of the good guys seem to have thought that he was the true head.

Maybe because Dumbledore was still alive, he would have had to perform a spell to hand over the office to the new Head, but once he was dead, the office didn't belong to anyone so Snape could just walk in.

The Headmaster's office

[terri-testing.livejournal.com]

I addressed this in my very first fiction, "To Do All in my Power" (testingt on the Occlumency archive): Headmaster Snape eventually realizes that he's in danger of being killed and replaced by a REAL Riddle plant before Harry/Dumbledore's side wins, and that should that happen, the real DE's exclusion from the Head's office would infallibly betray Snape's real sympathies, which would in turn allow Riddle to trace everything Snape had done as Headmaster to shield the children from Riddle's will.

My answer in that fiction was, the heads' portraits, if united unanimously, could keep out a Head they considered illegitimate. Or admit an illegitimate one to the apparent powers of the office.

So in this fic, it was the portraits who had closed the office to Dolores--and who opened it to Severus, Albus's chosen heir, whose true loyalty the portraits know upon Albus's death. They were there to hear Albus insist upon Snape's killing him, after all, and to hear Snape agree "to do all in his power to protect the students of Hogwarts" upon that unhappy event.

And Snape, knowing he might die and be replaced by a real DE, schemed with the portraits as to how they could allow his DE-replacement access to the physical office, and apparent access to the privileges of that office, while cutting the true-DE off from the real powers yielded by the acknowledge Head of Hogwarts.

If you don't like that reading, the next best I can think of is that Dumbledore personally sealed his office against Dolores.