HBP Chapter Sixteen: "A Very Frosty Christmas"

[for-diddled.livejournal.com]

* So Fred and George were trying to get Ron to make an unbreakable vow at the tender age of seven. Reminds me of one other wizard whose “powers… were surprisingly well-developed for such a young wizard and… he had some measure of control over them, and [had] begun to use them consciously.”

* Yikes, someone call the police, we’ve got a knife-throwing maniac in the Burrow.

* At least Mrs. Weasley seems like she actually misses Percy, which is more than you can say for the Twins.

* Fred and George going to see that muggle girl seems a bit creepy to me. Maybe I’m just over-reacting, but given the wizarding world’s general contempt of muggles and lack of qualms about using love potions and mind-altering magic, any relationship between a wizard and a muggle seems to have some rather worrying rape vibes.

* Well, at least Ron now believes Malfoy is up to something.

* Nobody will believe Snape was actually offering to help Draco, says Ron, because “they’re all convinced Snape’s in the order.” Yeah, because it’s not like any Order members have previously gone over to Voldemort, is it?

* Frankly I’m surprised Harry hasn’t already told Dumbledore what he saw.

* The Weasleys have paralysed a gnome, painted it gold and stuck it on top of their Christmas tree as an angel. There was a time when I’d have been shocked at such a blatant example of animal abuse; now, however, I’m just glad they didn’t turn it into slipper or vanish it.

* So is wizard music exactly the same as muggle music except with more mentions of cauldrons and wands?

* Remus is staring into the fire and hardly hearing Celestina’s song. Probably pining for Sirius and wishing he’d declared his love while Padfoot was still alive.

* It’s odd that everybody seems to dismiss Harry’s story on the grounds that “Snape was just pretending.” Even if you believe that, it still means that Malfoy’s up to something. Or does everyone just assume that Snape must have told Dumbledore what’s going on?

* Harry’s in danger of straying into heresy for a while, till Lupin brings him back to the true Church of Dumbledore. Trust Dumbledore! Don’t question His judgement, no matter what!

* Although Lupin does redeem himself very slightly by displaying a sensible attitude towards Snape. It’s nice to see that at least one person in this world can both not like somebody and be fair about their good qualities.

* Poor old Lupin. It’s bad enough that he to live with the werewolves, but knowing it’s all pointless and the war will be won by three not-particularly-bright teenagers hiding in a tent for several months makes it even worse.

* Still, Remus, it’s not all bad news. At least you aren’t with Tonks.

* I’m surprised muggle society hasn’t discovered the existence of werewolves yet. A group of strange wolf-men who survive by stealing your food and eating your children sounds like the sort of thing you might notice.

* I’ve probably said this before, but it’s quite striking to note the contrast between wizarding society, with its rampant prejudice against all sorts of groups, and Voldemort, who’s willing to reach out and work with traditionally excluded minority groups, albeit so that they can gang up and institute a brutal dictatorship over wizarding society.

* And the moral of the story is: don’t trust people who protest against bigotry, they’re probably just trying to get those shifty minority groups on their side so that they can launch a coup against the legitimate government.

* Yes Lupin, I’m sure that if a teenage boy referred to somebody’s “furry little problem”, all his schoolmates would instantly assume he was talking about a rabbit.

* Harry never thought to check how old his Potions book is? Man, that boy is slow on the uptake. If I were trying to found out who’d owned it, the age of the book would probably be the first thing I’d look at.

* I wish Fleur got more page time. She stands out as a beacon of sanity amidst the various screwed-up psychodramas of the Weasley family.

* Even when I first read HBP, I thought Lavender’s personality was yanked off course after the Christmas present scene. Earlier she seemed like a fairly nice, normal girl; now she gets changed into a dull, airheaded, overly-attached girlfriend stereotype. It seems that even minor characters cannot escape the curse of plot-induced personality transplants. L

* Although now I’m confused: I thought, based on the Weasleys, that tackiness was a sign of virtue in the wizarding world; now it turns out that it’s actually a sign of not being a suitable girlfriend. Maybe its significance changes depending on how important the character is.

* “We find we appreciate you more and more, mum, now we’re washing our own socks.” Yeah, waving your wand and saying “scourgify” must be really difficult. *rolls eyes*

* I doubt Fleur’s shudder was “affected”, actually, as most people would shudder if the person they were sitting next to turned out to have a maggot in their hair. Nor cheerfully pluck it out like Ginny. And nobody thinks to question how it got there. Are wizarding hygiene standards really so low that having insect larvae crawling over you is considered unremarkable?

* So Scrimgeour wanted to see Harry, but Dumbledore has been preventing him. So, clearly Fudge’s departure hasn’t broken his power. Is this a sign that Scrimgeour is actually every bit as weak and malleable as his predecessor was? Or does Dumbledore just have so much power (either through informal patronage networks or some kind of official governmental post – Chief Mugwump, perhaps) that he can obstruct government actions he doesn’t like, no matter who happens to be Minister at the time?

* I’m sorry, Harry, but “yeah” is not an appropriate way to address your head of government. Show a little respect, boy!

* How does Harry know that Stan Shunpike is innocent? He’s had, what, two conversations with the man in his entire life.

* “‘I don’t want to be used,’ said Harry.” Except by Dumbledore. Dumbledore’s twinkly and eccentric, so being used by him is totally fine.

* Maybe Scrimgeour should have tried offering Harry a sherbet lemon before he asked, that might have tipped the scales in his favour.

* Harry’s final line about being “Dumbledore’s man through and through” would be quite inspiring, if Dumbledore didn’t consistently repay people’s trust in him with lies, secrecy and manipulation.

Comments

[maidofkent.livejournal.com]

It’s odd that everybody seems to dismiss Harry’s story on the grounds that “Snape was just pretending.” Even if you believe that, it still means that Malfoy’s up to something. Or does everyone just assume that Snape must have told Dumbledore what’s going on?

Perhaps Dumbledore's told the Order that Draco has a DE initiation task which Severus is keeping an eye on, though that seems rather too much sharing for Albus. Considering the history of betrayal in the Order, which has affected Lupin personally, and the fact that he obviously doesn't trust Snape very enthusiastically you are right that it wouldn't do any harm to mention Harry's story to Dumbledore. The assumption you suggest could be quite dangerous in a time of war.

[oneandthetruth.livejournal.com]

Fred and George going to see that muggle girl seems a bit creepy to me. Maybe I’m just over-reacting, but given the wizarding world’s general contempt of muggles and lack of qualms about using love potions and mind-altering magic, any relationship between a wizard and a muggle seems to have some rather worrying rape vibes.

Or that creepy Jeremy Irons movie in which he plays identical twins who both sleep with a woman without telling her there are two of them.

Nobody will believe Snape was actually offering to help Draco, says Ron, because “they’re all convinced Snape’s in the order.” Yeah, because it’s not like any Order members have previously gone over to Voldemort, is it?

For that matter, Snape might be trying to convince Draco to join the "good" guys, particularly since he seems to genuinely care about the boy.

Harry’s in danger of straying into heresy for a while, till Lupin brings him back to the true Church of Dumbledore. Trust Dumbledore! Don’t question His judgement, no matter what!

I'm now imagining a parody of C. S. Lewis called Mere Harry Potter that makes the same sappy, backward, illogical arguments in favor of this series that Lewis makes in favor of Christianity.

I’ve probably said this before, but it’s quite striking to note the contrast between wizarding society, with its rampant prejudice against all sorts of groups, and Voldemort, who’s willing to reach out and work with traditionally excluded minority groups, albeit so that they can gang up and institute a brutal dictatorship over wizarding society.

No doubt that's in part where those stories come from that have Dumbledore as the bad guy maligning innocent Tom. I'm reading a good one now called, HP and the Mystery of Age, by teddylonglong on FFN. Be sure to read its prequel, Harry and the Unexpected Christmas first so you know what's going on.

I wish Fleur got more page time. She stands out as a beacon of sanity amidst the various screwed-up psychodramas of the Weasley family.

Well, yeah, that's why she has to be marginalized. ;-) Ditto for Lavender. If readers thought too much about how sane and decent Lavender seems, how well she treats Ron, and how well she and Ron get along, RW/HG would go straight down the tubes. We can't have that!

I doubt Fleur’s shudder was “affected”, actually, as most people would shudder if the person they were sitting next to turned out to have a maggot in their hair. Nor cheerfully pluck it out like Ginny. And nobody thinks to question how it got there. Are wizarding hygiene standards really so low that having insect larvae crawling over you is considered unremarkable?

I'm now wondering if Homo magicus is a less evolved species than Homo sapiens. That kind of grooming behavior is found in other non-human primates. That's not even to consider the really gross aspect of having maggots on your person, that I won't even go into out of consideration for my readers.

And yet these people have the nerve to make fun of Snape's grooming! Yeah, Lily, your precious son has maggots in his hair. Guess that gray underwear is looking pretty good right about now.

[kahran042]

That kind of grooming behavior is found in other non-human primates.

Now I'm wondering if Ginny ate the maggot, too.

[merrymelody.livejournal.com]

I’ve probably said this before, but it’s quite striking to note the contrast between wizarding society, with its rampant prejudice against all sorts of groups, and Voldemort, who’s willing to reach out and work with traditionally excluded minority groups, albeit so that they can gang up and institute a brutal dictatorship over wizarding society.

This. Also Filch, who doesn't interact with Voldemort, but is first associated with Snape in PS, then Umbridge in OotP (and in the DH movie, iirc, there was a shot of Slughorn treating his injuries. Which kind of fits in with the whole warrior ethos of the wizarding world - only a cowardly Slytherin would be nursing someone, because they didn't get injured/die heroically themselves.) while the Gryffindors are hexing him and calling him an idiot. Like you'd hope this would be a subtle point that maybe the goodies are isolating people with their own prejudices, but nope, it's actually that their moral compasses are developed enough to sense his evil (which coincidentally matches his incompetence at magic, just like the Dursleys. But not at all like the Ministry or Malfoys' attitude to Muggleborns and Muggles.)

[hwyla.livejournal.com]

You didn't specifically mention it, however, one of the things in retrospect that really bugs me in this chapter is Remus' pointing out the date of the book means the 'Prince' couldn't possibly be James. Not only is it a huge red herring - since the book does turn out to have belonged to someone from that same time period - but I now question that Remus didn't recognize that book.

I cannot decide whether Remus 'knowing' that SectumSempra was Snape's 'trademark curse' means that he had read the book or not. I can see no other way that Remus would know Snape used SectumSempra. We see him 'probably' use it in SWM, but non-verbally. IF he can successfully use it non-verbally, why would Sev ever use it verbally. And IF he really invented it (which you all know I don't believe) AND always used it non-verbally, then Remus wouldn't have any way of knowing what the curse was called. Unless he had read the book.

But if he had read SectumSempra in the book, then wouldn't he warn Harry about never using it? So, I then question whether Remus HAD or had NOT read it.

Of course, this also tends to suggest that Remus had heard if SectumSempra from somewhere other than the book - which tends to support the idea that Sev merely copied it down. Not trying to get off-topic here. I'm aware that many disagree with me on this.

It just keeps going in circles for me. Did the Marauders ever steal the book? And if so, why wouldn't Remus tell Harry that they HAD read it (only of course they 'found' it) and used it, giving Harry one more connection to his dad. We can be sure the book eventually got back to Sev, since some of the potions reworkings are from 6th year. So I cannot decide.

[mary-j-59.livejournal.com]

Evil Lupin solves your problems! Seriously, even if you think the man is merely weak, not evil, the one thing that's crystal clear about Lupin is that he does not always tell the truth. And he most often lies to defend himself, or the Marauders.

[oryx_leucoryx]

But Severus did shout 'Sectumsempra' in the 7P battle. Maybe he wanted to cast a stronger spell. Or maybe he was having trouble concentrating on the casting while flying. So it is possible that was the only time Remus heard the name of that spell, and realized that it was the same as the spell Severus used to cast silently back in their school days. In this case, Remus didn't need to have seen the spell in the book.

[hwyla.livejournal.com]

Thanks! I missed that. Tho' I still find it unbelievable that Sev could have been casting it at Hogwarts and not get expelled. So, I still have trouble with what Remus said about it being Sev's 'signature spell' - but it does somewhat solve the question of whether or not the Marauders stole his book. As long as the Crabbe & Goyle equivalents in Sev's time were casting his spells verbally, then the Marauders could easily pick his spells up without needing to get ahold of his book.

[oryx_leucoryx]

Remember that after the 7P battle Remus is speaking of 'Severus the traitor who killed Dumbledore' - everything he says is colored by that. Severus likely did cast Sectumsempra non-verbally at least once at Hogwarts, and he cast it in the battle at George who was impersonating Harry. So to Remus it looked like after killing Dumbledore, killing Harry was the next logical step for Severus. He just proved himself to be utterly evil. The fact that he used that very spell at school (regardless of context and difference in severity of the casting) only proved that he was utterly evil since a young age. I think we can ignore the 'signature spell' part as the words of a distressed man.

[dorea-ysleen.livejournal.com]

I agree with both of you. I'm also not sure how much having read the book would help with identifying the spell - there are no notations here, and judging from Levicorpus, the effects of the spells weren't generally mentioned even in the spells Severus definitely did invent himself. So even if you can guess some things from the Latin, I'm not sure Lupin & co. would necessarily have associated a little cut that apparently healed well enough not to inspire further mention with Sectumsempra.

The spells that really became popular, like Levicorpus, probably did leak through his friends, but he seems to have been cautious about a potentially dangerous spell like Septumsempra and only shared it selectively, if at all.

[for-diddled.livejournal.com]

Tho' I still find it unbelievable that Sev could have been casting it at Hogwarts and not get expelled.

Maybe he threatened to tell everybody what really happened in the Shrieking Shack... hmm... maybe Sev wasn't quite so shafted by Dumbledore as we all think...

[for-diddled.livejournal.com]

I suppose it's possible that Snape invented the spell, taught it to some of his friends, they used it verbally (being not as good as Snape at casting non-verbal spells), and the Marauders learnt about it that way?

[hwyla.livejournal.com]

This is what I had previously figured (pre-DH) for LeviCorpus. However, it still throws me that kids could be casting it around all over the school without getting expelled. There's loads of reasons why I cannot see Lupin as being truthful about it being Sev's 'signature spell'. But, just one student casting it in a memorable way could cause Remus to remember it later - without the book theft.

[wolf-willow31.livejournal.com]

... and the Marauders learnt about it that way?

Or maybe James learned about it while using his invisibility cloak to spy on Snape. He probably spied on Snape - and Lily - often. If you have a Deathly Hallow, you should use it for really important things like that, you know? Not just for nicking food and sneaking into Hogsmeade.

[aikaterini.livejournal.com]

/So Fred and George were trying to get Ron to make an unbreakable vow at the tender age of seven./

To be fair, they probably didn’t realize that it would kill him. Maybe they just heard about it from their parents or friends and thought that it would be cool to try. But since these are the same twins who killed Ron’s Pygmy Puff and turned his teddy bear into a spider, well, then…

/Nobody will believe Snape was actually offering to help Draco, says Ron, because “they’re all convinced Snape’s in the order.”/

Okay, but what about Snape’s ties to the Malfoys? Sirius knew about it, so why not the others? Even if Snape isn’t trying to help Draco with his mission for Voldemort, don’t any of them think that maybe he could be trying to steer Draco away from the path of his father?

/Even if you believe that, it still means that Malfoy’s up to something./

And he’s the son of a Death Eater who just got sent to Azkaban. It’s not like he’s some random student. Even if it could be considered judgmental to be suspicious of Draco because of his father’s actions, don’t any of them think that it’s worth looking into what Draco is doing?

/now she gets changed into a dull, airheaded, overly-attached girlfriend stereotype./

Her whole romance with Ron came out of nowhere. The only thing that barely suggested any kind of attraction or sparks was Ron’s crack in PoA: “Can I see Uranus too, Lavender?” But other than that, nothing. Nowhere in any of the other books did Ron or Lavender seem to like each other. Now all of a sudden, Lavender is so gaga over Ron that she’s giving him presents and squealing over him?

/Are wizarding hygiene standards really so low that having insect larvae crawling over you is considered unremarkable?/

Yet we’re supposed to look down at the Gaunts for living in a filthy shack.

[sunnyskywalker]

HBP would have made slightly more sense if Ron and Hermione had both gotten hit with some sort of anti-curiosity charm, at least with respect to curiosity about Draco. Dumbledore (and Snape?) could have reasoned that their interference might muck things up badly enough to get Snape killed, and probably Draco too, so it was for the greater good. Though I don't know why they wouldn't hit Harry with it too.

Or maybe they did, and it worked a little too well (explaining why he never thought to ask, "But Professor Dumbledore, how will we destroy a Horcrux if we find one?"). And Harry's continuing mission to find out what Draco is doing is, at root, based on obsession over an enemy rather than on actual curiosity.

[dorea-ysleen.livejournal.com]

* I doubt Fleur’s shudder was “affected”, actually, as most people would shudder if the person they were sitting next to turned out to have a maggot in their hair. Nor cheerfully pluck it out like Ginny. And nobody thinks to question how it got there. Are wizarding hygiene standards really so low that having insect larvae crawling over you is considered unremarkable?

In defense, it's likely that Harry shared the story of Kreacher's Christmas present, so they would know where the maggot from.

[oryx_leucoryx]

Remus is staring into the fire and hardly hearing Celestina’s song. Probably pining for Sirius and wishing he’d declared his love while Padfoot was still alive.

He is staring into the fire while listening to a song about cauldrons, while the conversation turned to Severus. This scene is popular among Snupin shippers.

Although Lupin does redeem himself very slightly by displaying a sensible attitude towards Snape. It’s nice to see that at least one person in this world can both not like somebody and be fair about their good qualities.

After spending time with other werewolves Remus finally started to appreciate Severus' Wolfsbane.

[rainbow-vagina.livejournal.com]

Gnomes are animals now?

[oryx_leucoryx]

They count as beasts in the Potterverse.