JKR and tears
Mar. 16th, 2014 10:25 pm![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
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deathtocapslockHi there everyone,
I used to be just ChoCedric, it has been a while since I've posted anything on this community, but I really needed to vent, and you guys are a great group of people to rant to, because I know you won't put me down, tell me that I'm just a big baby, or that my ideas are stupid.
I know I've said this on here before, but no matter how much time passes, I just can't seem to get over how JKR deals with emotion. It is often the case that when we are reading a book, we are told that it is good to think like the protagonist does, and it is definitely true in this case, what with JKR's comments about how the sun rises and sets on the saintlike Harry Potter.
As you all know by my username and by rants I've posted on this community before, this is particularly glaring to me in the example of Cho Chang. We are told to view her grief in a very negative light because a. she cries a lot, and b. she wants to know exactly what Cedric faced in his last moments. Because we, the readers, know what happened to him, we should just accept that others, those who knew and truly loved Cedric, don't need to have it explained to them. In the real world, if a teenage girl's boyfriend's corpse was dumped on a sports field with everyone ogling it and screaming, his blank, lifeless eyes staring into the sky, she would want to know why. And she'd hunt for answers, too. She wouldn't just wait until St. Albus Dumbledore the All-Knowing told her what had happened, and anyone who questioned St. Harry Potter, in the real world, would be considered reasonable people rather than evil incarnate.
I also honestly think that Rowling's whole issue with showing grief by crying is unfortunately something that many people in our society agree with, simply because of how Cho's behavior in OOtP was demonized by so many in the fandom. There are so many fans of Harry Potter that I talk to who say things like, "Oh, I couldn't stand Cho! She was such a bitch for crying all over poor Harry like that!" Those comments make me soooooo pissed! I think this is because so many in this day and age consider crying a weakness. God, could anything be more untrue? Granted, there's a time and a place to cry, but Cho was mainly doing it in bathrooms, and I think that's the perfect place! Yeah, maybe the outburst in Madame Puddifoot's was not quite the setting, but this was after months and months of her not knowing whether he'd suffered, whether he was in pain before he died, exactly what he'd been through. So I wholeheartedly understand why it happened.
When I mention that she and Cedric could have been very much in love (and I think this could definitely be the case, considering how lost and sad Cho was) I get rebuttals like, "But she's only a teenager! She doesn't even know what love is!" And that, too, is soooooo unbelievably untrue. I am 27 years old, and do you know how old I was when I dated my first serious boyfriend? I was 12! And we were very serious for many years. Believe me, if things hadn't worked out like they did, like the fact that he started drinking very heavily once he turned 21, and by heavily I mean so heavily that I was afraid he'd end up in hospital, I would be married to him today, if he'd continued to care for me as much as I cared for him, I loved him that much. He was everything to me. Even when our relationship started going to the dogs, I stuck it out for another 11 months because I wasn't ready to give up on him, I thought it was just a phase he was going through. And no, don't worry, he wasn't physically abusive. He just started getting very possessive and very jealous of who I hung out with, even if it was just with my sister, for Merlin's sake! But we'd had so much history together that I wasn't ready to let him go when things started to go downhill.
But that's enough about me. What I'm trying to say is that it's not unheard of for people who meet and fall in love very young to stay together. Granted, it's not unbelievably common, but it does happen. So the "you can't fall in love as a teenager!" thing just doesn't wash.
Please tell me any other thoughts you have on this! I know we've talked about this before, but do you guys agree that it's to do with the society we are growing up in that JKR considers tears really, really bad and seething, frothing rage really, really good? How do you think Harry would have reacted if Ginny's cold, lifeless body had been dropped in front of him?
I used to be just ChoCedric, it has been a while since I've posted anything on this community, but I really needed to vent, and you guys are a great group of people to rant to, because I know you won't put me down, tell me that I'm just a big baby, or that my ideas are stupid.
I know I've said this on here before, but no matter how much time passes, I just can't seem to get over how JKR deals with emotion. It is often the case that when we are reading a book, we are told that it is good to think like the protagonist does, and it is definitely true in this case, what with JKR's comments about how the sun rises and sets on the saintlike Harry Potter.
As you all know by my username and by rants I've posted on this community before, this is particularly glaring to me in the example of Cho Chang. We are told to view her grief in a very negative light because a. she cries a lot, and b. she wants to know exactly what Cedric faced in his last moments. Because we, the readers, know what happened to him, we should just accept that others, those who knew and truly loved Cedric, don't need to have it explained to them. In the real world, if a teenage girl's boyfriend's corpse was dumped on a sports field with everyone ogling it and screaming, his blank, lifeless eyes staring into the sky, she would want to know why. And she'd hunt for answers, too. She wouldn't just wait until St. Albus Dumbledore the All-Knowing told her what had happened, and anyone who questioned St. Harry Potter, in the real world, would be considered reasonable people rather than evil incarnate.
I also honestly think that Rowling's whole issue with showing grief by crying is unfortunately something that many people in our society agree with, simply because of how Cho's behavior in OOtP was demonized by so many in the fandom. There are so many fans of Harry Potter that I talk to who say things like, "Oh, I couldn't stand Cho! She was such a bitch for crying all over poor Harry like that!" Those comments make me soooooo pissed! I think this is because so many in this day and age consider crying a weakness. God, could anything be more untrue? Granted, there's a time and a place to cry, but Cho was mainly doing it in bathrooms, and I think that's the perfect place! Yeah, maybe the outburst in Madame Puddifoot's was not quite the setting, but this was after months and months of her not knowing whether he'd suffered, whether he was in pain before he died, exactly what he'd been through. So I wholeheartedly understand why it happened.
When I mention that she and Cedric could have been very much in love (and I think this could definitely be the case, considering how lost and sad Cho was) I get rebuttals like, "But she's only a teenager! She doesn't even know what love is!" And that, too, is soooooo unbelievably untrue. I am 27 years old, and do you know how old I was when I dated my first serious boyfriend? I was 12! And we were very serious for many years. Believe me, if things hadn't worked out like they did, like the fact that he started drinking very heavily once he turned 21, and by heavily I mean so heavily that I was afraid he'd end up in hospital, I would be married to him today, if he'd continued to care for me as much as I cared for him, I loved him that much. He was everything to me. Even when our relationship started going to the dogs, I stuck it out for another 11 months because I wasn't ready to give up on him, I thought it was just a phase he was going through. And no, don't worry, he wasn't physically abusive. He just started getting very possessive and very jealous of who I hung out with, even if it was just with my sister, for Merlin's sake! But we'd had so much history together that I wasn't ready to let him go when things started to go downhill.
But that's enough about me. What I'm trying to say is that it's not unheard of for people who meet and fall in love very young to stay together. Granted, it's not unbelievably common, but it does happen. So the "you can't fall in love as a teenager!" thing just doesn't wash.
Please tell me any other thoughts you have on this! I know we've talked about this before, but do you guys agree that it's to do with the society we are growing up in that JKR considers tears really, really bad and seething, frothing rage really, really good? How do you think Harry would have reacted if Ginny's cold, lifeless body had been dropped in front of him?
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Date: 2014-03-17 02:09 pm (UTC)I mean, suppose Ron had died and Harry grieved. Would it be fair to tell Harry that well, they were only teenage school friends and their friendship was based more on shallow things like living in the same dorm and liking sports, and they would have much deeper and truer friendships as adults, so really he should just get over it already? Oh hell no.
Here in Muggle-land, we send grief counselors to schools when a kid dies in some horrible and unforeseen manner, and not just for the kid's best friends and love interests. Because we recognize that even the kid's casual acquaintances might be freaked out and traumatized, and that this is a normal and expected thing.
So to me, the question of precisely how in love Cho and Cedric were is barely relevant. Her grieving and being confused and angry and scared and just about anything else is totally legitimate and understandable regardless. Cedric's friends and dorm-mates and Quidditch teammates might well be going through similar processes, just as fairly. And I don't see why this is such a hard concept to grasp!
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Date: 2014-03-17 09:41 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2014-04-09 05:58 am (UTC)*Headdesks*
-- David W. from thehpn
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Date: 2014-03-17 10:36 pm (UTC)That does make it way worse. She died right when her emotions were strongest. I'd equate that to crashing right in the middle of a dizzying high instead of coming down slowly. I mean, it's just such a shock to the system.
I'm glad Hermione at least attempted to scratch the surface of what Cho might possibly have been feeling, even if it was just a glance. The audience could do with a little more "think about how this person is feeling".