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deathtocapslockHi, first time poster, long (long, long, long) time lurker. I almost want to apologize for making this post, as it's about one of the most (and yet not enough?!) oft-repeated complaints surrounding DH, namely the handling of the motivations behind one Severus Snape.
A tl;dr background of myself: I read the first six books some time in 2006-7 and become absolutely consumed by the series. And then DH broke my heart to pieces with its release. I spent the next 5 years recovering those pieces and healing, and thankfully I was still able to find fans whose opinions still jived with mine up until 2012, when I woke up one morning and finally threw the series away in disgust and through weariness. For reasons unknown to me, I've started dabbling with fandom again recently - I suspect I'm probably in that stage where I need a new hobby but have nothing new to fall back on so I'm nostalgic. Because I was a fan for so short a time before the series concluded, I've always almost felt like I was never a "true" fan since I wasn't part of most of the discourse pre-DH. And yet I consider myself as being from "that generation of HP fans", and not the newer generation made up of so many Snape-haters I see on more currently relevant social media platforms like Reddit and Tumblr. I hope that doesn't make me sound elitist but, well, fuck it, lol (we can swear, right??).
And that brings me to why I'm here: it's amazing how the general sentiment in fandom has shifted so drastically from the loudest voices pre-DH saying how much they love Snape to the present post-DH era, where he's reduced to a friend-zoned, incel, Nice Guy {insert whatever other labels anti-Snape fans attach to him}. The point I'm really trying to make is: I feel almost completely out of touch with most places discussing Snape on the Internet except for DTCL. I truly want to thank you all for still being around, from the bottom of my heart. I hope this is okay, but I particularly want to thank torchedsong for making her post also talking about how Snape was flattened as a character - it made me realize there are still people around in the fandom who remembered the potential he used to have.
And now to come to the title of the post. I want to wholeheartedly reject the "Lily as end-all, be-all" motivation. So I was wondering:
- What would YOU have liked for Snape's motivation to have been for becoming Dumbledore's man?
- What kind of scenario do you imagine led him to make the change?
- Prior to the release of DH, what were you /hoping/ for his motivation to be?
I have to admit that I struggle with these questions myself. For example, a number of slash fans played with with idea of Snape's motivation to have been Regulus Black. And honestly, while this would have been less of a character-destroying reveal (not that JKR would ever actually go down this route), it would make the matter of Snape's opinions regarding blood politics and his moral development more complicated. So an additional question:
- What kind of motivation/catalyst would you have liked for Snape to realize that not just violence but any kind of discrimination based on blood is wrong? (Unless you would have been fine for him to just have a personal, selfish motive behind betraying Voldemort, that's fine too).
Thank you ♡
A tl;dr background of myself: I read the first six books some time in 2006-7 and become absolutely consumed by the series. And then DH broke my heart to pieces with its release. I spent the next 5 years recovering those pieces and healing, and thankfully I was still able to find fans whose opinions still jived with mine up until 2012, when I woke up one morning and finally threw the series away in disgust and through weariness. For reasons unknown to me, I've started dabbling with fandom again recently - I suspect I'm probably in that stage where I need a new hobby but have nothing new to fall back on so I'm nostalgic. Because I was a fan for so short a time before the series concluded, I've always almost felt like I was never a "true" fan since I wasn't part of most of the discourse pre-DH. And yet I consider myself as being from "that generation of HP fans", and not the newer generation made up of so many Snape-haters I see on more currently relevant social media platforms like Reddit and Tumblr. I hope that doesn't make me sound elitist but, well, fuck it, lol (we can swear, right??).
And that brings me to why I'm here: it's amazing how the general sentiment in fandom has shifted so drastically from the loudest voices pre-DH saying how much they love Snape to the present post-DH era, where he's reduced to a friend-zoned, incel, Nice Guy {insert whatever other labels anti-Snape fans attach to him}. The point I'm really trying to make is: I feel almost completely out of touch with most places discussing Snape on the Internet except for DTCL. I truly want to thank you all for still being around, from the bottom of my heart. I hope this is okay, but I particularly want to thank torchedsong for making her post also talking about how Snape was flattened as a character - it made me realize there are still people around in the fandom who remembered the potential he used to have.
And now to come to the title of the post. I want to wholeheartedly reject the "Lily as end-all, be-all" motivation. So I was wondering:
- What would YOU have liked for Snape's motivation to have been for becoming Dumbledore's man?
- What kind of scenario do you imagine led him to make the change?
- Prior to the release of DH, what were you /hoping/ for his motivation to be?
I have to admit that I struggle with these questions myself. For example, a number of slash fans played with with idea of Snape's motivation to have been Regulus Black. And honestly, while this would have been less of a character-destroying reveal (not that JKR would ever actually go down this route), it would make the matter of Snape's opinions regarding blood politics and his moral development more complicated. So an additional question:
- What kind of motivation/catalyst would you have liked for Snape to realize that not just violence but any kind of discrimination based on blood is wrong? (Unless you would have been fine for him to just have a personal, selfish motive behind betraying Voldemort, that's fine too).
Thank you ♡
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Date: 2019-06-15 05:06 pm (UTC)If the former, then yeah I can do some rambling :)
While Snape never was my favourite character, I always respected him as an intelligent (by Jo's standards) character. Thus I always thought that there was more to him joining DE than peer pressure and metaphorical "Come to the Dark Side, we have Cookies!". Perhaps Severus could agree with what Voldie's recruiters said. "We cannot openly follow our traditions! All because some muggleborns were offended!" "Last year ICW outlawed rain-calling ritual! The rain-calling ritual! That is preposterous!" "Muggles are poisoning rivers and cutting down forests! They are destroying our planet!"
But of course what recruiters say and what the boss orders is different. At first it's something small. Perhaps a raid on one of Dumbledor's followers. They are wizards, but surely they deserved it, right? Then something bigger. Perhaps kidnapping muggles and organising a "fox-hunt" in forest? They are defenceless and hunted like animals...
Then something much bigger. A torture of fellow follower for something small? Or execution of DE Sev knows personally? Snape realises that his boss is madman... but he isn't quite ready to abandon the ship, because there is no one else who aligns with his political position and actually does something about it
And then Voldie targets his ex-best friend for having a child who one day might defeat him. It's both personal and goes against Severus' principles- targetting a new-born?
The thing is Severus doesn't like to go against his principles. At all. And this is the breaking point where he cannot explain away Voldemort's actions.
Yes, he asks Voldemort to spare Lily, but he is a Slytherin. He is not going to believe that a madman will honour his promise. He is going to out-manoeuvre him however he can. So he goes to Dumbledore. What he doesn't expect, is for Dumbledore to be even more manipulative than the Head of Slytherin. After the first meeting where Albus is so in-the-face manipulative, Severus dons his game-face and next time they end up having heated discussion. The end result? Agree to disagree.
In the end Severus ends up staying at Hogwarts, not because of Voldemort's order or Dumbledore's protection, but to keep eye on Albus. After all Albus has a lot of power and good intentions, but piss-poor methods and ideas going opposite direction to Sev's.
That being said I don't think that Severus ever discriminated based on blood. In fact I don't think that "mudblood" insult is just about blood status. I think it's more about assimilation into society thing. Let's just look at Hermione: one day she discovers that House Elves are thing and from Harry's POV it seems it seems she doesn't ask why things are the way they are. Instead she assumes that HE are slaves and tries to bully other people to join her campaign. That kind attitude would drive any conservative insane. Heck, if you took something more innocent like fireworks during 4th July and applied Hermione's attitude anybody would be weirded out.
As for insults? Nobody complained when I posted so I don't think that you would get any :P