Deathly Hallows Chapter 27
Nov. 9th, 2009 11:11 pm![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
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deathtocapslockDeathly Hallows Chapter 27
The Final Hiding Place
I wonder if this chapter name is supposed to be a pun. Because we have references to Voldemort’s final hiding place (for his Horcruxes) and the Trio does a protective spell circle after they fall off the dragon, so this is their final hiding place.
The chapter starts with them on the back of a dragon, being carried away to goodness-knows-where. Ron’s swearing as they go—although Harry can’t tell if that means he likes it or hates it. Hermione is sobbing. Harry doesn’t seem to have much of a reaction, beyond fear that they’ll fall off.
So, before they land, I’m thinking that this is all very alchemical, when you tie it in with the previous chapter. As you recall, their quest took them deep underground, where they encountered a magical-quenching waterfall and a fiery volcano of treasure. Now, they rushing through the air. So, we managed to hit on all the four elements.
Is there meaning to all this? Not really, but it does make sense of things that seemed a bit superfluous before. At least to me. For example, while it was a pretty effective counter-thief defense to have treasure magical copy itself and burn the thieves, it seemed like overkill. But, if you are determined to include the element of fire in the escapade, then check, there it is.
Harry worries about how soon Voldemort is going to realize that the golden cup is gone from Bellatrix’s vault. Can you guess how long it will take?
They are traveling north, and Harry wonders if they are going to hit the coast line soon, and if the dragon is as hungry as he is, and if it’s ever going to notice the three edible humans on its back. Then he wonders for a while where he left that spare t-shirt and whether it’s going to be Jater or Skater in the final Lost episode and…
Why is this taking so long? Oh… I get it. The sky is now turning indigo, which means that JKR wanted to wait until nightfall for the next part of the adventure. And, as we recall, the Trio set off on their heist before the sun rose at Shell Cottage. So, once again, we have to kill 12 hours on the back of a dragon.
Finally, the dragon starts circling a small lake in some vast wilderness. I’m guessing we’re in Scotland by this point. Harry tells the others to jump into the lake when he gives the signal—and they do.
They emerge, sputtering, from the lake water, to see the dragon flying off into the distance. He never even seemed to notice they were riding him, let alone that they jumped off.
One thing JKR did that I like was to make the dragons animals. They are magical beasts, but they aren’t wise or avaricious or Sean Connery in CGI drag. They are just big, huge animals that do normal animals things—except notice people riding on them.
The Trio starts swimming for the shore and eventually gets there. Hermione seems to be in the worst shape, since she collapses as soon as she’s on dry(ish) ground. Harry has enough stamina to stagger to his feet and cast protective spells. Ron does pretty much nothing.
Does anyone wonder about all those terrible burns they got from the treasure in Bellatrix’s vault? Don’t worry. Hermione has dittany! It cures everything! Of course, since they are Gryffindors, there is a lot of manly wincing as they drip the dittany onto their wounds.
Hermione is getting smarter. This time she brought pumpkin juice, figuring they would need some kind of refreshment after their heist. It’s such a funny little detail. They sit on the shore, swigging pumpkin juice as they contemplate the cup they now have and the sword that they don’t. If pumpkin juice really existed, I’d think JKR was doing product placement.
Actually, that probably says more about how cynical I am than about JKR—or even Warner Brothers. Don’t mind me….
Ron makes a joke about wearing the cup around their necks, and Hermione worries about the dragon, and Ron makes another joke about people noticing that they broke into Gringotts… and they are all so tired and giddy they just lie back on the grass and start laughing.
I like that moment. I almost even like these characters again.
Harry then gets a vision—and we know exactly how long it takes Voldemort to find out they stole the cup, because he watches Voldemort finding out. A “small, quaking” goblin kneels before Voldemort to inform him about the robbery. There is, for some reason, a circle of Death Eaters surrounding the goblin. I guess you need a lot of back-up when you’re dealing with goblins. Sneaky little cheaters that they are.
Voldemort screams with rage at the knowledge that “the boy” discovered his secret. Then, he kills the goblin, and, that not being enough, he starts killing all the Death Eaters in the room. Except that Lucius and Bellatrix manage to escape by throwing others behind them in their rush for the door.
I thought Lucius and Bellatrix were confined to Malfoy Manor? Is this taking place at Malfoy Manor? It doesn’t seem like it. But maybe it’s just another room we haven’t seen yet. The goblin reception room.
Voldemort paces through the dead corpses, raging and thinking hard. Did the boy know about the other Horcruxes? Is the first one he’s found or has he already acted on the others? How did he know? Did Dumbledore figure it out? Dumbledore, who is dead… whose wand he holds…. Reaching out through death to pwn him?
Great. Now we have Voldemort obsessing about Dumbledore. I wonder if he’s read the biography yet.
Voldemort starts worrying about his Horcuxes and wondering if they are safe. And then he starts listing them in his mind. Which gives Harry a handy way of knowing exactly what they are all are and where Voldemort put them.
So this whole secret quest has been counterproductive. If Dumbledore had made it public, then Voldemort would have started listing them two years ago. And Harry would have seen it (but for that convenient Occlumency thing that Voldemort dropped as soon as he started getting emotional), and they would have known. Two years ago.
Without having to manipulate Slughorn for his memories. Without having to risk Harry chasing them down on his own. Without camping.
So, now, two years later, Harry finds out directly from Voldemort that the final Horcrux is hidden somewhere in Hogwarts.
Harry comes out of his vision to find Ron and Hermione looking at him with concern. As he struggles to sit up, he notices the golden cup “lying innocently in the grass.” This is why I did the two DVD scenes where Snape finds the cup and Lupin destroys it. Because this Horcrux doesn’t behave like any of the other Horcruxes we’ve seen. It doesn’t have evil eyes that try to distract you when you stab it. It doesn’t talk to you. It doesn’t move. It doesn’t curse. It doesn’t do anything.
So, it makes sense to me that, just like the fake locket, they have a fake cup. The real Horcrux was discovered and destroyed by other, smarter wizards.
Although Voldemort conveniently let Harry know that the last Horcrux is at Hogwarts, he inconveniently neglected to think about what it was or where exactly it was hidden. Which means we have four chapters to go before they find out.
We have an obligatory argument from Hermione that they need to plan how to get into Hogwarts. Thankfully, Harry shuts her up and they just put on the cloak and Apparate to Hogsmeade.
Fan Service:
Thank goodness, JKR included the air element in the last alchemical quest!
Fan Slappage:
Yes, there are dragons, but where is Charlie Weasley? And, more importantly, where are his dragon-leather pants?????
DVD Extras:
INT: NIGHT – MALFOY MANOR
We are looking at an empty ballroom. MUFFLED SCREAMS OF RAGE can be heard coming from behind a closed door. After a moment, a long window curtain rustles and Lucius Malfoy and Bellatrix Lestrange peek their heads around it from both sides.
LUCIUS
Do you think he’s finished?
BELLATRIX
Wait for it….
There is one final, prolonged scream.
BELLATRIX (cont’d)
Now he’s done.
They come out from behind the curtain. Bellatrix makes a beeline for the closed door. She slips quietly through it.
Lucius makes a beeline for the liquor cabinet. He pours himself a large firewhiskey while STAN SHUNPIKE emerges from under a table.
SHUNPIKE
Merlin’s pants! That was close, that was! What der yer s’pose ‘Arry Potter stole, anyways?
LUCIUS
(knocking back the drink)
No idea.
SHUNPIKE
He ain’t always loike this, is ‘E?
LUCIUS
It’s about par. Didn’t they cover that in the orientation?
Bellatrix comes back in, carrying a handful of wands. Lucius glances at her, one eyebrow raised.
BELLATRIX
(shrugging)
They aren’t going to use them anymore.
She hands one to Lucius, who waves it experimentally.
BELLATRIX
He’s gone off to check on something. He said we should wait for instructions. (sighing) He’s so sexy when he’s angry.
SHUNPIKE
Are you mental? He just killed a dozen blokes! They’re dead, they are!
Bellatrix glances, puzzled at Lucius, who replies:
LUCIUS
New guy.
Bellatrix sizes up Shunpike and decides he’s not worth talking to. Instead, she selects a wand and uses it to cast a silvery light in the shape of a heart.
BELLATRIX
He’s got a new wand, you know. Do you think he’d let me use his old one? (Running her finger over the wand in her hand) Yew wood. Thirteen and a half inches. Unyielding.
Shunpike stares at her, appalled. Lucius uses his new wand to pour another drink.
LUCIUS
You know the most ironic thing? I think we just lost more Death Eaters than we did in the entire first war.
A SHRIEK comes from behind the door.
BELLATRIX
Cissy’s back.
NARCISSA (off-screen)
WHO LEFT THESE BODIES IN MY ATRIUM?!!
FADE OUT
The Final Hiding Place
I wonder if this chapter name is supposed to be a pun. Because we have references to Voldemort’s final hiding place (for his Horcruxes) and the Trio does a protective spell circle after they fall off the dragon, so this is their final hiding place.
The chapter starts with them on the back of a dragon, being carried away to goodness-knows-where. Ron’s swearing as they go—although Harry can’t tell if that means he likes it or hates it. Hermione is sobbing. Harry doesn’t seem to have much of a reaction, beyond fear that they’ll fall off.
So, before they land, I’m thinking that this is all very alchemical, when you tie it in with the previous chapter. As you recall, their quest took them deep underground, where they encountered a magical-quenching waterfall and a fiery volcano of treasure. Now, they rushing through the air. So, we managed to hit on all the four elements.
Is there meaning to all this? Not really, but it does make sense of things that seemed a bit superfluous before. At least to me. For example, while it was a pretty effective counter-thief defense to have treasure magical copy itself and burn the thieves, it seemed like overkill. But, if you are determined to include the element of fire in the escapade, then check, there it is.
Harry worries about how soon Voldemort is going to realize that the golden cup is gone from Bellatrix’s vault. Can you guess how long it will take?
They are traveling north, and Harry wonders if they are going to hit the coast line soon, and if the dragon is as hungry as he is, and if it’s ever going to notice the three edible humans on its back. Then he wonders for a while where he left that spare t-shirt and whether it’s going to be Jater or Skater in the final Lost episode and…
Why is this taking so long? Oh… I get it. The sky is now turning indigo, which means that JKR wanted to wait until nightfall for the next part of the adventure. And, as we recall, the Trio set off on their heist before the sun rose at Shell Cottage. So, once again, we have to kill 12 hours on the back of a dragon.
Finally, the dragon starts circling a small lake in some vast wilderness. I’m guessing we’re in Scotland by this point. Harry tells the others to jump into the lake when he gives the signal—and they do.
They emerge, sputtering, from the lake water, to see the dragon flying off into the distance. He never even seemed to notice they were riding him, let alone that they jumped off.
One thing JKR did that I like was to make the dragons animals. They are magical beasts, but they aren’t wise or avaricious or Sean Connery in CGI drag. They are just big, huge animals that do normal animals things—except notice people riding on them.
The Trio starts swimming for the shore and eventually gets there. Hermione seems to be in the worst shape, since she collapses as soon as she’s on dry(ish) ground. Harry has enough stamina to stagger to his feet and cast protective spells. Ron does pretty much nothing.
Does anyone wonder about all those terrible burns they got from the treasure in Bellatrix’s vault? Don’t worry. Hermione has dittany! It cures everything! Of course, since they are Gryffindors, there is a lot of manly wincing as they drip the dittany onto their wounds.
Hermione is getting smarter. This time she brought pumpkin juice, figuring they would need some kind of refreshment after their heist. It’s such a funny little detail. They sit on the shore, swigging pumpkin juice as they contemplate the cup they now have and the sword that they don’t. If pumpkin juice really existed, I’d think JKR was doing product placement.
Actually, that probably says more about how cynical I am than about JKR—or even Warner Brothers. Don’t mind me….
Ron makes a joke about wearing the cup around their necks, and Hermione worries about the dragon, and Ron makes another joke about people noticing that they broke into Gringotts… and they are all so tired and giddy they just lie back on the grass and start laughing.
I like that moment. I almost even like these characters again.
Harry then gets a vision—and we know exactly how long it takes Voldemort to find out they stole the cup, because he watches Voldemort finding out. A “small, quaking” goblin kneels before Voldemort to inform him about the robbery. There is, for some reason, a circle of Death Eaters surrounding the goblin. I guess you need a lot of back-up when you’re dealing with goblins. Sneaky little cheaters that they are.
Voldemort screams with rage at the knowledge that “the boy” discovered his secret. Then, he kills the goblin, and, that not being enough, he starts killing all the Death Eaters in the room. Except that Lucius and Bellatrix manage to escape by throwing others behind them in their rush for the door.
I thought Lucius and Bellatrix were confined to Malfoy Manor? Is this taking place at Malfoy Manor? It doesn’t seem like it. But maybe it’s just another room we haven’t seen yet. The goblin reception room.
Voldemort paces through the dead corpses, raging and thinking hard. Did the boy know about the other Horcruxes? Is the first one he’s found or has he already acted on the others? How did he know? Did Dumbledore figure it out? Dumbledore, who is dead… whose wand he holds…. Reaching out through death to pwn him?
Great. Now we have Voldemort obsessing about Dumbledore. I wonder if he’s read the biography yet.
Voldemort starts worrying about his Horcuxes and wondering if they are safe. And then he starts listing them in his mind. Which gives Harry a handy way of knowing exactly what they are all are and where Voldemort put them.
So this whole secret quest has been counterproductive. If Dumbledore had made it public, then Voldemort would have started listing them two years ago. And Harry would have seen it (but for that convenient Occlumency thing that Voldemort dropped as soon as he started getting emotional), and they would have known. Two years ago.
Without having to manipulate Slughorn for his memories. Without having to risk Harry chasing them down on his own. Without camping.
So, now, two years later, Harry finds out directly from Voldemort that the final Horcrux is hidden somewhere in Hogwarts.
Harry comes out of his vision to find Ron and Hermione looking at him with concern. As he struggles to sit up, he notices the golden cup “lying innocently in the grass.” This is why I did the two DVD scenes where Snape finds the cup and Lupin destroys it. Because this Horcrux doesn’t behave like any of the other Horcruxes we’ve seen. It doesn’t have evil eyes that try to distract you when you stab it. It doesn’t talk to you. It doesn’t move. It doesn’t curse. It doesn’t do anything.
So, it makes sense to me that, just like the fake locket, they have a fake cup. The real Horcrux was discovered and destroyed by other, smarter wizards.
Although Voldemort conveniently let Harry know that the last Horcrux is at Hogwarts, he inconveniently neglected to think about what it was or where exactly it was hidden. Which means we have four chapters to go before they find out.
We have an obligatory argument from Hermione that they need to plan how to get into Hogwarts. Thankfully, Harry shuts her up and they just put on the cloak and Apparate to Hogsmeade.
Fan Service:
Thank goodness, JKR included the air element in the last alchemical quest!
Fan Slappage:
Yes, there are dragons, but where is Charlie Weasley? And, more importantly, where are his dragon-leather pants?????
DVD Extras:
INT: NIGHT – MALFOY MANOR
We are looking at an empty ballroom. MUFFLED SCREAMS OF RAGE can be heard coming from behind a closed door. After a moment, a long window curtain rustles and Lucius Malfoy and Bellatrix Lestrange peek their heads around it from both sides.
LUCIUS
Do you think he’s finished?
BELLATRIX
Wait for it….
There is one final, prolonged scream.
BELLATRIX (cont’d)
Now he’s done.
They come out from behind the curtain. Bellatrix makes a beeline for the closed door. She slips quietly through it.
Lucius makes a beeline for the liquor cabinet. He pours himself a large firewhiskey while STAN SHUNPIKE emerges from under a table.
SHUNPIKE
Merlin’s pants! That was close, that was! What der yer s’pose ‘Arry Potter stole, anyways?
LUCIUS
(knocking back the drink)
No idea.
SHUNPIKE
He ain’t always loike this, is ‘E?
LUCIUS
It’s about par. Didn’t they cover that in the orientation?
Bellatrix comes back in, carrying a handful of wands. Lucius glances at her, one eyebrow raised.
BELLATRIX
(shrugging)
They aren’t going to use them anymore.
She hands one to Lucius, who waves it experimentally.
BELLATRIX
He’s gone off to check on something. He said we should wait for instructions. (sighing) He’s so sexy when he’s angry.
SHUNPIKE
Are you mental? He just killed a dozen blokes! They’re dead, they are!
Bellatrix glances, puzzled at Lucius, who replies:
LUCIUS
New guy.
Bellatrix sizes up Shunpike and decides he’s not worth talking to. Instead, she selects a wand and uses it to cast a silvery light in the shape of a heart.
BELLATRIX
He’s got a new wand, you know. Do you think he’d let me use his old one? (Running her finger over the wand in her hand) Yew wood. Thirteen and a half inches. Unyielding.
Shunpike stares at her, appalled. Lucius uses his new wand to pour another drink.
LUCIUS
You know the most ironic thing? I think we just lost more Death Eaters than we did in the entire first war.
A SHRIEK comes from behind the door.
BELLATRIX
Cissy’s back.
NARCISSA (off-screen)
WHO LEFT THESE BODIES IN MY ATRIUM?!!
FADE OUT
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no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 09:28 am (UTC)No wonder Ron decided to drive a Muggle car later in life, though.
no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 02:34 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 02:35 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 03:53 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 03:57 pm (UTC)But yes, it's at least 12 twelve hours. Want to know something really silly? I looked up the sunrise/sunset times for, I think, Glasgow when I was working on a Snape story and it was more like 20 hours from sunrise to sunset in that time of year.
Of course, the sunrise might be later in London.
no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 03:58 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 04:03 pm (UTC)If they were going to put a thematic illustration on the cover, it would have to be of the Trio in their tent: Harry obsessing over Dumbledore, Hermione cooking, and Ron looking really bored.
no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 06:16 pm (UTC)Why? Was it stated *why* they started so early? Do magical banks not work normal business hours? I’d have thought a 24 hour bank would be far more vulnerable. Why open a bank at Dawn when there are so few people about? Did they wait outside for 3 hours for it to open? Wouldn’t the hour before opening be the height of the rush hour – the worst time for attracting attention - except possibly lunch-time. Did they make an exception for Bellatrix and let her in especially? How did the Trio know they'd do that? Maybe I’m applying Muggle culture here, but why didn't JKR make them leave at 3.30pm? Not only would the streets have been quieter, but if it was January (which it SHOULD have been) they’d be facing darkness within half an hour. Wouldn’t that be preferable to making an escape in broad daylight if anything went wrong? 'Bellatrix' at least should have transfigured a jacket into a cloak and obscured her face right until she got up to the doors of the bank, especially as her 'performance' wasn't the best.
Afterwards, they could have ridden the dragon for 20 mins, and escaped from it somewhere in Hertfordshire (just North of London). That would mean Voldemort would hear about the break-in within an hour, not after 12 hours – as if it could be kept from him for that long. Even if this *had* to happen in May, it would still more than halve the pointless amount of time in the air. The Trio could then APPARATE up North to Hogwarts – in a few attempts if it’s too large a distance. None of this book seems to have been thought about – just published.
I once had a nightmare about this (!) Harry, Ron and I jumped off the dragon, which then stopped to drink from the lake. Ron kept telling us to hurry – he said the dragon would need to drink first, *then* would want to eat – us. As we crawled out of the water, the dragon was lapping the water at the far end of the lake and watching us with a predatory look in his eye. Then it stopped and started to fly towards us , just as we realised that Hermione had been left behind in the bank and none of us knew how to apparate. I woke up panicking, but with a few tweaks, eg the Trio quickly apparating elsewhere, my silly dream could have made more sense than this version with a giant, vicious, instinctive and abused predator being unaware of its edible passengers.
I agree that JKR is usually ok with her animal depictions, so we were at least spared a grateful dragon that merrily waved goodbye to them!
--- “Voldemort screams with rage at the knowledge that “the boy” discovered his secret. Then, he kills the goblin, and, that not being enough, he starts killing all the Death Eaters in the room. Except that Lucius and Bellatrix manage to escape by throwing others behind them in their rush for the door.”
Mwah!! The Wizarding Community is quite small, if he’s left to it, Voldemort would defeat himself by exterminating all his followers. All the Order need to do is feed him rather bad news every now and again.
At this point, surely a burst of anger from Voldemort making Harry collapse to the floor would be enough? They could easily work out what his problem was. Or maybe a hazy connection could continue as he kills, when he’s still feasibly angry enough to have his guard down, but stop once he starts to think? We didn’t need Voldie-cam to turn into a transcript of his thoughts, not least because the more time we spend with him, the more foolish he seems. Maybe an earlier conversation before the bank caper, could have lead to the Trio deciding that they needed to search Hogwarts at some point, so they decide that they need to sneak in now. It would be better if they got there and worked things out for themselves. Voldemort telling them all they need to know, when they need to know is lazy writing.
Still loving the DVD extras. If Stan wasn't a willing Death Eater, JKR is a maths ace.
no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 06:31 pm (UTC)It's still not as bad as in Order of the Phoenix, when Harry's beloved Godfather is apparently being tortured to death and he takes the scenic route to London via Thestral (and I doubt they can fly as fast as a dragon). Someone else might fly the Thestrals to Hogsmeade, then sneakily use Madam Rosmerta's fireplace to get to the Ministry asap, but not Harry, oh no!
no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 07:56 pm (UTC)What kind of kills me is that I've been mildly burned a bunch of times. I guess that's first degree? (Just looked it up--I've had mostly first degree and some second degree burns.) Anyway, I always seem to drop boiling water on myself or grab a hot pan every Christmas, so I'm familiar with the sensation. And the way it goes is that it hurts like hell until you put something cold on it. Then you take it off, and it heats up again and becomes unbearable in 5-10 minutes.
So, you spend a few hours holding cold compresses up to the burn and then the pain tapers off. By the way, if you ever drop boiling hot tea in your lap, refrigerated 2-liter soda bottles are the way to go.
But by 12-20 hours, the pain would have mainly worn off in first or second degree burns. Third degree? They'd be dead.
no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 08:06 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 08:07 pm (UTC)It's not exactly an explanation, but Harry orders Bill and Fleur to stay in their beds until the Trio leaves. I would call that pretty ripe for Harry to be giving orders to his hosts, but they're probably happy to do it. I mean, it's Bill and Fleur after all.
Anyway, it would very rude to make everyone in the house stay in bed until three in the afternoon just so they don't see Hermione get into her Bellatrix garb. Maybe they could have requested that everyone go around with blindfolds on, instead.
By the way, I don't know that they were in Scotland. I'm sort of going by the wild landscape and lack of people... but I don't know boo about English/Scottish geography, so it's all a guess.
For all I know they are in Hertfordshire and the dragon was only traveling 2 MPH. Like a blimp, as Marionros put it.
Mwah!! The Wizarding Community is quite small, if he’s left to it, Voldemort would defeat himself by exterminating all his followers. All the Order need to do is feed him rather bad news every now and again.
Seriously. This was all they really needed to do in order to defeat him. All that research Dumbledore did on Voldemort and he never figured that one out....
And he really should have. He kept telling Harry how "terrible" Voldemort's anger was to behold when anything went wrong. He shouldn't have kept his Horcrux hunts secret. He should have been rubbing Voldemort's nose in it every time he found one.
And if Voldemort decided to move them? That's time and energy that Voldemort would be wasting and more chances to screw up. And if he decided to make more? That just makes his soul less and less stable. Pretty soon it would just disintegrate like a piece of tissue in water.
no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 08:41 pm (UTC)Don't worry. I'm sure if the dragon had Slytherins on its back it would have noticed and tossed them off. Animals all have the anti-antagonist/pro-heroes instinct.
Seriously, how many Death Eaters are there? It seems like they don't start with many at all, and then Voldemort keeps offing them in crowds.
I love Lucius and Bellatrix running away, though. Tell me again how you guys ever wanted to join this guy?
Oh god, that's hilarious with Voldemort giving Harry the answer. Which is the way the whole book goes. He sits around for years and then someone walks by and tells him the answer. All that "searching" for the Horcrux? Not actually searching at all. Just treading water. Which is exactly what it felt like.
no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 08:48 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 09:11 pm (UTC)Which might explain why, for all the pages devoted to camping, we got very little of actual searching. The longest passage I remember was one paragraph (during Harry's obsession with the Deathly Hallows) where Ron hauls them to different towns on the off-chance that Voldemort might have been there.
no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 09:12 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-11-10 09:28 pm (UTC)JKR could have had Harry feeling guilty because the poor dragon was obviously suffering from wasted muscles and was having trouble flying and he doubted their weight was helping. Or if not guilty, seeing as its Harry, at least observing how unusally slow it was going. I'd buy that after its lifetime in captivity, but JKR prefers not explain (or change) her nonsense.
Also, why didn't they leave Shell Cottage at first light to avoid being seen, then hide out in the tent until it was time to put the plan into action? That'd give them time to go over their plan yet again, Hermione could practice Bellatrix's walk and manner etc. Not being seen by the occupants of Shell Cottage was not (or shouldn't have been)the key part of their plan. It's all nonsense I tell you!
no subject
Date: 2009-11-11 12:12 am (UTC)Aside: I guess I'm feeling sorry for the right thing, for once? Usually it's more like, pathetic Muggleborns in Diagon Alley? Meh. Nigellus' portrait, trapped forever, forced to do Dumbledore's or whoever's will, stuffed in bags, blindfolded, carried on heists, having to listen to whiny kids for months? No! The whole portrait thing really disturbs me. It's like they've been sent to Hell instead of enjoying a dignified retirement.
I read these books so differently than others. I just ran across a Hog's Head's summary of Chapter 13. It's... so different.
I missed Voldemort's mass slaughter of minions the first and only time I read DH. Shows how much it added to his character development for me, and how much I was skipping over the story at this point.
Video-Voldemort: Worst Plot Device Ever.
I love your jaded Lucius and swoony Bellatrix, but I think she rather enjoyed her brother-in-law's emasculation. Did he actually fight with a wand in the final battle, or just mope around, delivering messages like a House-Elf?
no subject
Date: 2009-11-11 04:11 am (UTC)Hehe. Can you believe I've actually thought about this? Okay... so as far we know, Lucius doesn't have a wand. Neither does Bellatrix. Unless they took the wands confiscated from the Trio by the Snatchers. But I doubt it, since Narcissa gave her own wand to Draco. Would she have done that if he could have simply taken one of the ones from the Snatchers?
BUT! It's only a couple hours between the moment Voldemort kills all the Death Eaters and the Malfoys show up at the final battle. Bellatrix is fully enwanded, or else she couldn't be dueling. We don't see either Lucius or Narcissa with wands. But if they didn't have wands, how did they get there?
They could have side-Apparated with Bellatrix, but she'd need a wand to do that. Why would she have a wand and the others not have ones?
So, gathering a few wands from the fallen Death Eaters makes the most sense to me.
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Date: 2009-11-11 12:48 pm (UTC)This line made me weep. It reminded me of the time when we all thought there was some hidden meaning below the surface, something that transcended the simple straightforward story. Alas - as it turns out there wasn't even a straightforward story involved!
I guess you need a lot of back-up when you’re dealing with goblins. Sneaky little cheaters that they are.
Swarthy. You forgot swarthy.
when you stab it. It doesn’t talk to you. It doesn’t move. It doesn’t curse. It doesn’t do anything.
Well, it's the Hufflepuff Horcrux. Hufflepuffs are the quintessential couch potatoes. They don't do anything but sit around until they die. If they are good, that is. The others tread on firsies while exhibiting Slytherinesque qualities - which means the cup should have sort of rolled unobtrusively under a bush or something.
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Date: 2009-11-11 03:01 pm (UTC)I know what you mean about the Muggleborns. Exactly what could they accomplish by hanging around Diagon Alley wandless? And exactly what was it about the Death Eaters that made them think they'd show any mercy, as opposed to just killing them for a laugh? Why not return to their muggle roots to regain their strenth, or to get together and form a plan of action? Also, they could break that Secrecy Rule - what would they have to lose if they wanted to get their children back? On an individual basis, wizards are stronger than muggles, but the difference in numbers is vast - as it's written it would make perfect sense to get Muggles involved.
I can understand that JKR didn't want that complication, so why not close it down properly? If Wizards can control muggle minds, how far would a Wizard/Muggle battle go? What's the point of guns/tanks etc if you're being made too use them on each other? Also, if Ron has a Put-Outter, I refuse to believe that Wizards can't shut down all electricity plants. They could bring the Western World to its knees effortessly. Don't tell me Leaders wouldn't just keep quiet and let the desperate Muggle-Borns go to Hell. If she had to write them as pathetic, she should have removed what seem like obvious alternatives.
I assumed all this automatically as I read it - I'm a fan w*nker - it's only when reading re-caps that I realized that it was all in my mind and JKR never said any of it. It would have made Scrimgeour seem very sinister if he'd pointed it out to the Prime Minister in HBP. Sigh.
I hear you on Video-Voldemort.
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Date: 2009-11-11 05:44 pm (UTC)That's what Rowling said in an interview about the portraits, that portraits were faint imprints of people who can only speak catchphrases. (Hmm, wonder where she got the idea?) The problem is that portraits can choose to move to new places, can pretend to be asleep, can argue, and can fool people like Hermione about how trapped they really are. They can also learn new information and add that to their memories. It seems they have self-awareness and limited agency. Maybe, like Dumbledore, previous Headmasters were so full of their own self-importance they felt nobody could make a move without their advice, not that the advice was followed or even respected. Yes, a thankless existence.
I've watched a few episodes of Red Dwarf on public television in U.S., but without starting at the beginning, I never understood it. Various Star Trek series, especially Next Generation with its nanites, holograms, and Data, did a good job of asking how a living thing is defined and what the consequences are of making that definition. Rowling wasn't going there; she just needed Nigellus to relay information and be a "good" Slytherin (is usually a dead Slytherin and/or an enslaved one).
As for the Muggleborns, Harry was raised as a Muggle. When his wand was broken, did he feel sorry for himself and depend on others to do everything for him (I mean, more than usual)? Did he crave magic so much he'd follow any shimmering phantasm just to be close to it? He'd never end up in that alley.
I've long thought that magic is a drug that hooks wizards and makes them feel they do incredible things, but also makes them stupid -- like alcohol, or for some, marijuana. Heroin and cocaine would be dark magic.
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Date: 2009-11-11 06:13 pm (UTC)I'm a Nigellus fan because he's so difficult, disdainful, and unbowed. It's a large part of my I'm a Snape fan, too. Don't let the bastards get you down, don't go gentle into that good night, etc.
Nigellus' portrait was more than just another nattering former-Headmaster gossip. It's not like he/it was ELIZA, although that would have been fun. (There used to be an "Ask Snape" site based on ELIZA, but it no longer seems to exist.)
In DH, almost all the characters were objectified by the needs of the plot.
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Date: 2009-11-11 07:33 pm (UTC)People are still trying to get similar programs to do more than regurgitate pre-stored answers. The museum I work at recently tested a talking heads system that was supposed to learn from patron questions. It never worked. Lots of museums and public spaces try these kinds of patron interaction systems. So do educational developers, trying to replace teachers with computerized "smart" tutors.
If you type ELIZA into a search engine, you'll find some working examples. The program is incredibly irritating... which is why I think it would be hilarious for the portraits.
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Date: 2009-11-11 10:57 pm (UTC)Actually, considering some of the (very sweet) wizrock kids I know, you might be right. But still, there are a lot of us who read differently! In any case, I felt as you do - except that, by the end of the previous chapter, I was so bored and frustrated that I'd pretty much stopped reading. So that, when my sister wrote a song about the bank heist, I was staring at her saying, "Wait - that's in the book?"
Just to give you a taste of the flavor, here's the first verse, copyrighted to Grrl 2 of the Gringotts Grrls and all original names and materials copyrighted to JK Rowling and not used for profit:
The Beautiful Bellatrix Lestrange
Has undergone an awful change!
She's shrunk ten inches; her hair has gone frizzy
And everyone's in a terrible tizzy! And
That inarticulate friend of hers
(he's Transylvanian, she avers)-
His massive muscles have disappeared
And he's got red hair now. Isn't that weird?
(chorus)
Oh oh Harry Potter,
Harry Potter,
He's a very crafty plotter.
But we think it
Really stank when
Harry Potter
Broke the Bank!
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Date: 2009-11-12 04:04 am (UTC)Actually, the castle would be aware of *all* the legitimate residents of the castle, although if a former student never returns, the castle may not retain those memories over decades of absence.
But it doesn't have *unlimited* memory storage. So once it understands that the former Head is no longer alive, and it isn't going to be able to deal with them any more, it offloads its memories into a portrait, and starts assembling its memories of the replacement. I would imagine that the longer the tenure as Head, or the longer residence of the person who becomes Head in the castle, the more exact the likeness and the more well realized the personality.
Albus lived in the castle for most of a century, depending on how early he returned as a teacher, and was Head for about 30 years. Snape may have been Head for less than a year, but he lived in that castle for most of his life.
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Date: 2009-11-12 06:30 am (UTC)This line made me weep. It reminded me of the time when we all thought there was some hidden meaning below the surface, something that transcended the simple straightforward story. Alas - as it turns out there wasn't even a straightforward story involved!
Yes--I loved the idea of all this alchemical symbolism, but I must confess that alchemy is beyond my comprehension. The problem was that JKR didn't seem to understand it any better than I do! Which is--enough to incorporate the elements and symbolism, but not enough to really make it mean anything.
...which means the cup should have sort of rolled unobtrusively under a bush or something.
That could have been really funny. :)
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Date: 2009-11-12 06:31 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-11-13 07:15 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-11-15 12:07 am (UTC)I thought Lucius and Bellatrix were confined to Malfoy Manor? Is this taking place at Malfoy Manor?
I was so confused by this scene for some reason. I didn't quite know what was going on, but didn't want to spend too much time trying to figure it out. Frankly, I think your dvd extra is spot on. ;D
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Date: 2009-12-04 08:23 pm (UTC)Possibly her wand worked best for him. In PS she is the one who buys him a wand while he is at Madam Malkin's. (Does this mean Draco had already practiced with his mother's wand beforehand so they had reason to expect she could buy him a suitable one? Is Draco the ultimate mama's boy?)